Transport ships of USSR in 1941-1945 - any info!!

Discussions on all aspects of the USSR, from the Russian Civil War till the end of the Great Patriotic War and the war against Japan. Hosted by Art.
Post Reply
User avatar
BIGpanzer
Member
Posts: 2812
Joined: 12 Dec 2004, 23:51
Location: Central Europe

#166

Post by BIGpanzer » 22 Feb 2006, 03:56

Hi, Marty!
As for "KIM". When I made search in Internet, using "KIM" in Russian letters I found several sites, which mention that cargo ship. It was written that "KIM" was used by ChGMP. I have also 3 volumes of Russian naval encyclopedia (Sankt-Petersburg, Sudostroenie, 1993), which I bought in Petersburg in 1998 or 1999 because of interesting illustrations, when I was there for scientific conference. It was written there that "KIM" and "Komsomol" (III series of Max Hoelz-type cargo ships) made together their first navigation in spring 1933 to Odessa (Black Sea) and was accepted by ChGMP. Since 1934 they made regular navigations between Soviet Black Sea ports and USA ports.

Regarding "Komsomol". Well, of course, nobody knows for sure what happened exactly with that ship because of political reasons. I agree that "Komsomol" could transport manganese ore to Denmark and some ammunition /armament (sources I could find mention food for Spanich civilians or tanks for republicans) for republican Spain in addition, when it was stopped by "Canarias" in December 1936. Moreover this seems quite possible as "Komsomol" was used for military aid transportation to Spain since October 1936 (port of destination - Cartagena), transporting the first 50 tanks to republicans. On the other hand - we can not prove this and it was possible that "Komsomol" made also its usual civil cargo navigations to UK, USA and Denmark during that period as trade couldn't stop.
It is interesting also that all Soviet ships, were stopped/sunk by Nationalist Spanish warships, didn't transport military aid (transported civil cargos or was empty after successful delivery of military aid) and those facts really caused diplomatic incidents.
As for "Komsomol" - the ship was stopped by Spanish "Canarias" in international waters near Algeria (not in Spanish waters!, USSR sent to Spain volunteers and was not in war with Nationalist Spain officially, ship had civil merchant flag), "Canarias" abused international lows in that case and created a crime, which caused a great diplomatic incident. Also I am thinking if USSR/France helped Republican Forces and Germans/Italians helped to Nationalist Forces which military aid could be named as contrabanda - Soviet/French, German/Italian, both or nobody's? As I never interested in politics but only in vessels, I don't know exactly. But AFAIK official Spanish government was republican, and if so Soviet aid couldn't be named as contrabanda, but support for official government. "Komsomol" and other ships transported also medicaments and food for Spanish civilians.

As for sinking of "Komsomol". I agree with the possibility of your version, but again nobody knows for sure what happened. Different Internet sources give differ info because of their political preferences in my opinion. Many Russian, some English and some German sources describe the accident as the following. "Canarias" ordered to stop the ship, took all crewmembers from life-boats, explore the holds of "Komsomol" (and found only manganese ore) and sank the ship by artillery fire. On the other hand, several Spanish and German sources give the info close to yours: "Komsomol" was scuttled by its crew to prevent its capture by "Canarias" (and this fact could be also viewed from two different points: did the crew members try to create incident especially or try to prevent capture of their ship and expensive cargo by potential enemy warship?). It will be excellent to find the photos of destroyed by artillery fire or scuttled "Komsomol", made from the board of "Canarias", but I am absolutely not sure were such photos made or not. "Canarias" could destroy "Komsomol" just because the ship was famous among Republican forces and transported a large military aid to them, including a lot of tanks.
Also I found a mention that captain of "Komsomol" G.Mezentsev wrote his own book in 1938 ("Last raid of "Komsomol"") but I think it is almost impossible to find it and as it was written in 1938 Mezentsev couldn't write the all details of the accident because of political reasons. Also I found the info that one of the sailors from "Komsomol" - I. Gajdaenko wrote a story about this accident after liberation from Spanish prison (Soviet sailors were exchanged on Nationalist high-rank officers).
I will try to find the info from different sources and will post all possible data about that accident. Just now I am reading about cruiser "Canarias" and its raids against Republican ships, transported national gold to France. Interesting, that "Komsomol was sunk during such raid of "Canarias".

I also found a mention that probably "Komsomol" tried to avoid the capture by "Canarias" in French territorial waters near Algeria (as France also supported Republican Spain), but heavy cruiser "Canarias" had max speed 32-34 knots, and cargo ship "Komsomol" - only 10-11 knots..........But this info is also doubtful as "Komsomol" was sunk not very far away from Gibraltar and that route was usual from Mediterranean to Atlantic.

Anyway in navigation logs the coordinates 36° 39' 0° 15' are designated as the place of death of Soviet ship "Komsomol" (in memory of Soviet sailors and volunteers were fallen during the Spanish civil war 1936-1939)

It should be noted that Nationalist Spanish warships, including submarines, made a really pirate raids and sunk several Soviet, French and even British, Danish and Norwegian cargo ships in Mediterranean. 30 April 1937 Scandinavian, Soviet, British and French steamship companies made an official protest to the Ligue of Nations. 10.09.1937 in Nion (Switzerland) the Nion Treaty was signed - according to the Treaty British and French navies should control Mediterrenean and sank every Nationalist Spanish warship in the case of pirate crimes (except the attacks of Republican ships by Nationalist ships during civil war). All other involved countries (USSR, UK, France, USA, Greece, Turkey, Romania, Yugoslavia, Bulgaria, Egypt) should control their territorial waters. After that the number of attacks of Nationalist warships on foreign transport ships decreased a lot till winter 1937/1938. USSR ones sent bomber squadron from Spanish airfield to sink "Canarias", but pilots didn't find it. Also according to Nion Treaty it was possble for USSR to sent cruiser from Black Sea Navy to Mediterranean, but Stalin decided not to do this.

Also I found these links, but still don't have time to read them -
http://admiral.centro.ru/memor02.htm
http://www.galeon.com/razonespanola/r113-cap.htm
Google helped to find even this: http://download.sovmusic.ru/m/teplkoms.mp3 (very famous in 1930s song about sunk ship "Komsomol")

Best regards, BP

User avatar
Dido
Member
Posts: 86
Joined: 03 Jan 2006, 22:53
Location: Greece

#167

Post by Dido » 23 Feb 2006, 11:24

Hi everyone! I am looking for details concerning the loss of the Josif Stalin. Apparently she was mined and never repaired. What was the extend of the damage? The Soviets seemed to be able to repair German captured vessels that had suffered worst damage or that had spent several years submerged. Was Josif Stalin scrapped during or after the war?

Regards


User avatar
BIGpanzer
Member
Posts: 2812
Joined: 12 Dec 2004, 23:51
Location: Central Europe

#168

Post by BIGpanzer » 23 Feb 2006, 16:05

Hello, Dido! Glad to help you!

As you probably know there were several ships under the name "Iosif Stalin" in Soviet merchant navy. One of them was large icebreaker "I. Stalin", 11242 t (see my post here from 5 August) - the flagship icebreaker of Soviet arctic fleet. "I. Stalin" guided the north arctic (including PQ-QP) convoys and military ships during the whole WWII as armed icebreaker, lightly damaged by German bombers.

As for "Iosif Stalin" you are interested in. That was Soviet passenger turboelectric ship. It was used by Baltic State Shipping Company (BGMP) before German-Soviet war and was mobilized as military transport under the name VT-521, participated in evacuation of thousands of civilians during the first months of the war.
Two ships of that type were built in 1939 by Dutch N.V. Nederlandsche Dok & Scheepsbouw Maats especially for USSR ("Iosif Stalin" and "Vyacheslav Molotov"/later "Baltika"). They should be used at Soviet Far East, but because of very dangerous navigations towards Pacific during WWII they were accepted by BGMP. Two just finished turboelectric ships left Amsterdam 01.05.1940 and they were the last ships, who did this - 10.05.1940 the Netherlands were occupied by Germans. In April 1941 "Vyacheslav Molotov" was at guarantee repairs in Sweden (Stockholm), 18 June 1941 came to Leningrad. "Vyacheslav Molotov" was mobilized as military transport VT-509 after the beginning of war.
Specifications: 8945 t; 135x18.34 m; 421 passengers; 2x9010 hp steam turbines; 16 knots; 8950 miles; 161 men crew.


"Iosif Stalin" was heavily damaged 03-05.12.1941 in the central part of Gulf of Finland (59°54', 25°09').
Details of its death: "Iosif Stalin" participated in the evacuation of Soviet garrison from naval base Hango (Finland, it was rent by Soviets after Winter war). 03.12.1941 during the convoy navigation from Hango to Kronshtadt with 5589 men on-board the clumsy and fully loaded ship was exploded by 3 sea mines one by one (also one mine exploded closely to the ship in side protector-paravan without any damages for the ship) despite the anti-mine manoeuvring and side paravans. Ship was damaged (damaged stern, destroyed hold No. 3, destroyed nose cabins 3rd class, where many people were killed, fixed rudder because of electric system was switched off by explosions, steam turbines were stopped, anchor was dropped by explosion also). Crew members could right the ship and start one steam turbine, also they tried to cut the anchor chain.
Soon Finnish coastal artillery opened fire against convoy and "Iosif Stalin" was hit by heavy 12'(305mm) shell which caused explosion of transported ammunition (hull No 2). The ship began to sink. Its tawing by escorting destroyers under Finnish fire and stormy weather was useless, also a very large mine field surrounded convoy, several mine-sweepers were damaged and one exploded in this area. Soviet mine-sweepers No. 205, 211, 215, 217 and 5 patrol boats of the convoy defense could rescue 1740 men, also panic occured on-board. Convoy went further on and water-logged "Iosif Stalin" (water reached main deck) drifted towards Estonian sea shore and ran aground. Planned Soviet night rescue operation 04.12.1941 was aborted because of the explosion of one participated mine-sweeper by sea mine, also mine-sweepers were delayed because of replacement of mine-sweeps. Survived crew members of "Iosif Stalin" and evacuated sailors from Hango garrison were captured by German forces and sent to German and Finnish labor camps, where the majority dead. That fact was hidden by Soviets for a long time as some coward commanders/commissars from "Iosif Stalin" ordered their men (near 3000) to capitulate despite that they had armament and ammunition and could organize a good shore defence or heroically exploded the ship, full of transported shells. As the ship had the name "Iosif Stalin" that fact was hidden especially.
11.07.1945 the ship was raised by Soviets and was towed to Tallinn, where it was scrapped later because of bad technical condition.

"Vyacheslav Molotov" (since 1957 - "Baltika") was used as military transport under the name VT-509, evacuated wounded soldiers from Tallinn naval base in summer 1941, was exploded then by sea mine/damaged by bombs and towed in fog to Leningrad for repair. The ship was used as stationary hospital during the blockade of Leningrad, also its powerful radiostation transmissed news and its workshop produced parts for the shells. The stationary ship was lightly damaged in the beginning of 1943 during the German artillery fire. After WWII - one of the best ship of Leningrad-London route, made navigations to many European countries, Cuba, USA, transported many international delegations, including XX Olympic Games. In 1984 the old but still very good and comfortable ship was reequipped in Denmark. Interesting, that the ship was very popular among tourists and official representatives all over the world as it absolutely never delayed because of excellent work of the crew. In 1986 the ship was discarded despite its good technical condition, but it was used one time more during the official visit of Soviet president M.Gorbachev to Reykjavik. Soon after that "Baltika" was sold to Pakistan for scrapping despite the protests of many sailors, who adviced to make a naval museum or five-star hotel from the ship.

http://www.sea.infoflot.ru/shems/1/13

http://www.sea.infoflot.ru/photo/1/26.jpg ("Vyacheslav Molotov", Odessa, Black Sea)
http://www.sea.infoflot.ru/photo/1/161.jpg ("Baltika")
http://www.sea.infoflot.ru/photo/1/162.jpg ("Baltika")
http://www.sea.infoflot.ru/photo/1/88.jpg ("Baltika")


Regards, BP

User avatar
BIGpanzer
Member
Posts: 2812
Joined: 12 Dec 2004, 23:51
Location: Central Europe

#169

Post by BIGpanzer » 06 Mar 2006, 02:22

Some short info about Soviet ships of "Elpidifor"-type we have mentioned above.

"Elpidifor" was an unofficial name of WWI period (1914-1918) for Black & Azov Seas Russian coastal cargo steamers, which were mobilized by Black Sea Navy and widely used during WWI as mine-sweepers, mine-layers, gun-boats and landing ships. All "Elpidifor"s had different displacements (500-1200 t), but they were of similar design: coastal steam schooners (self-propelled barges) with 2-4 holds in the centre and 2 steam engines in the stern. They have large cargo capacity, but small draft (0.6 - 3 m); good seagoing ability and meneuvrability. "Elpidifor"s were used for coasting navigations and transportation of grain/corn from the rivers of Black/Azov Seas basin to ocean-going ships before WWI.
The name "Elpidifor" originated from the mobilized in 1914 steamer "Elpidifor" (since 1916 - T-230): was built in 1905, cargo capacity 850 t, 64x10.3x2.9 m, 2 steam engines (440 kW total), 11 knots.

But the ships we are discussing about are "Elpidifor"s, were ordered in 1917 for Russian Black Sea Navy as universal auxiliary vessels ("landing steamers"). They were laid down by Nikolaev Shipyard "Russud" (during the Soviet times - 61 communard Shipyard). The project was developed according the use of "Elpidifor"s during WWI. It was planned to built 30, but later it was decided to built 20 "Elpidifor"s (Elpidifor N 410-429). All were laid down till the end of WWI, steam engines were produced by Nikolaev factory "Naval" (during the Soviet times - Black Sea Shipyard).

Specifications: 1300 t, 74.7x10.4x1.8 m, 2 steam engines (1200 hp total), 10 knots, 3x102mm+2x76mm guns + 2 MGs, up to 120 mines, crew 33 men.

"Elpidifor"s N 410-412 were finished and accepted by navy till the end of WWI, in 1920 they were captured by Russian White Forces during the Russian Civil war and moved abroad. All other "Elpidifor"s were finished only by Soviets in 1920s: N 413-417 as gun-boats (N 415 was sunk in combat in January 1921); many were used as civil/military tankers or coal barges - N 418 ("Vasily Fimin", "Valery Chkalov", in 1930s it was used as cargo ship), N 419 ("Alexander Emshanov", "Stakhanovets"), N 420 and 421 (barges "Berezan" and "Tendra"), N 422 served as tanker-refueler "Krasnaya Moldavia", 5 "Elpidifor"s were finished only in 1927-1929 (N 423 as dry-cargo ship "Volgo-Don", N 424-427 as ore-carriers for Azov Sea "Gornyak", "Iosif Kosior"/later "Azov", "Metallist" and "Sovetsky Krym").
Last edited by BIGpanzer on 08 Mar 2006, 17:16, edited 2 times in total.

User avatar
BIGpanzer
Member
Posts: 2812
Joined: 12 Dec 2004, 23:51
Location: Central Europe

#170

Post by BIGpanzer » 06 Mar 2006, 16:17

Blueprint of "Elpidifor" N 410 in 1918 - http://wunderwaffe.narod.ru/Magazine/MK ... raw/90.jpg

Mine-sweeper of "Elpidifor"-type during WWII - http://sovnavy-ww2.by.ru/minesweepers/pic/elpidifor.jpg

Mine-sweeper T-486 during WWII (not of "Elpidifor"-type, but of similar design. Previous steam schooner "Sofia", was built in 1880 in Newcastle) - http://sovnavy-ww2.by.ru/minesweepers/pic/sofia.jpg
Mine-sweeper T-497 during WWII (not of "Elpidifor"-type, but of similar design. Previous steam schooner "Egurcha") - http://sovnavy-ww2.by.ru/minesweepers/pic/egurcha.jpg

User avatar
Dido
Member
Posts: 86
Joined: 03 Jan 2006, 22:53
Location: Greece

#171

Post by Dido » 06 Mar 2006, 23:43

I came accross some information on a Soviet ship named KHARKOV which was captured by the Germans in 1943 and renamed BOY FEDDERSEN only to be sunk by a combined aircraft and submarine action late on off Krimea. She was built in 1914 for the North German Lloyd as ANHALT, seized by the UK in 1919, sailed in 1922-24 as the Spanish AYA-MENDI and was sold to the Soviet Union in 1932.
I had never heard of a major Soviet vessel been captured by the Germans and being fit for service. Are there any other cases?
Was the KHARKOV a freighter and are there any pictures of her?

Best regards!

User avatar
BIGpanzer
Member
Posts: 2812
Joined: 12 Dec 2004, 23:51
Location: Central Europe

#172

Post by BIGpanzer » 07 Mar 2006, 01:55

Hi, Dido! Have you read the info about "Iosif Stalin" passenger turboelectric ship you asked me for? I've posted the info especially for you (see my post from 23 February). Why no thanks?! :? :wink:

As for the ship "Kharkov". I know that cargo ship "Kharkov" from ChGMP (6689 brutto-tons, built in 1914) was exploded 14.08.1941 by its crew in Nikolaev (Black Sea) to prevent its capture by Germans (one source mentions that the ship was sunk by German bombers in Nikolaev port, but I believe that it was exploded by its crew as the majoruty of my sources give such info). Later it was raised and repaired by Germans (so not directly captured!) and renamed as "Boy Feddersen". 10 August 1943 the ship was heavily damaged by Soviet submarine D-4 and 5 Soviet torpedo bombers Douglas A-20 "Boston" from 30th MTAP (mine-and-torpedo air regiment). At first ship was torpedoed by bombers (two torpedo hits) and in 10 min by submarine (one torpedo hit). Next day the ship sank during towing by Germans to Evpatoria port (45°03N 33°08E, 75-91 m deep).

Other source mentions that cargo ships "Boy Feddersen" and "Varna" (escorted by two Romanian destroyers, one mine-layer, one gun-boat and several patrol boats) was attacked by five Il-4 torpedo bombers from 5th Guard MTAP together with two A-20 torpedo bombers from 36th MTAP and was hit by torpedo from Il-4 bomber (left side, engine space) and by torpedo from A-20 bomber (right side, coal bunker). Both successful bombers were knocked down by AA fire from escorting ships. In 8 minutes two A-20 bombers bombed the damaged ship, 16 100-kg bombs exploded closely to the ship and damaged it more (hold No. 6 was flooded). In addition one Il-4 torpedoed the ship again, but unsuccessfully, and submarine D-4 also couldn't hit the damaged ship by 4 torpedoes. So a little bit different info according to different sources. But the majority of sources give the info about successful attack of D-4. That submarine sank also Bulgarian steamer "Varna" (2141 t), 20 August 1943.
Heavily damaged "Boy Feddersen" before submersion - http://www.diving-alpha.ru/content/imag ... pg/420.jpg
See also http://www.vnitu.home.ro/convoi-jun43.JPG ("Boy Feddersen" in convoy, escorted by Romanian vessels)

Short history of "Kharkov":
March 1914 Bremer Vulkan, Vegesack
1914-1919 ANHALT NDL, Bremen Ge laid up from Aug 1914 at Telang Betok, Java
1919-1921 ANHALT The Shipping Controller, London Br/ (British India Steam Nav Co Ltd)
1921 ANHALT Hogarth Shipping Co Ltd (H. Hogarth & Sons), Ardrossan British
1921-1925 AYA-MENDI Cia Naviera Sota y Aznar, Bilbao Spain
1925-1932 ANHALT NDL, Bremen Germany
1932-1941 KHARKOV Sovtorgflot, Odessa USSR
14.08.1941 exploded at Nicolaev
Autumn 1941 - raised by Germans
1942-1943 BOY FEDDERSEN German
11.8.1943 sunk near Evpatoria by Soviet torpedo bombers and submarine D-4
Popular place for divers till now.

AFAIK 8 ships from Estonian Shipping Company (180 t - 2500 t) and 14 ships from Latvian Shipping Company (117 t - 4650 t) were captured by Germans in summer 1941 because those ships were under repait at Baltic Sea ports.
Also 6 ships from Baltic Shipping Company (1799 t - 3979 t), 16 ships from Latvian Shipping Company (1250 t - 4107 t) and 13 ships from Estonian Shipping Company (607 t - 7800 t) were captured/interned in German/Polish/Dutch/Portuguese/Danish/Swedish ports during the first days of the German-Soviet war.
But I need to check my sources to find the info about their possible use in German service then.

mjbollinger
Member
Posts: 238
Joined: 14 Sep 2005, 02:23
Location: Great Falls, VA

German Seizures of Russian Ships

#173

Post by mjbollinger » 07 Mar 2006, 03:06

Here is a list of ships taken in various ways by Axis forces:

Scuttled incomplete by Soviets, raised and later finished
STEPAN RAZIN (ALARICH)

Scuttled by Soviets, later raised and returned to service
MARIAMPOL (FRIEDERICH KARL II)
PSKOV (TULA) - by Romania
CHICHERIN
VOLOCHAEVKA (THEODORICH)
VOLGA-DON
KHARKOV (BOY FEDDERSEN)

Scuttled, later raised by Germans/Romanians but not returned to service before war's end
VOIKOV
OREL
EVERIGA
PLEKHANOV
BALAKLAVA
MARS (not 100% certain she was raised -- bit of a mystery ship)

Taken in prize by Germany in June 1941 (or shortly afterwards)
KONSULS P. DANNEBERGS (BRAUNAU)
DNESTR (PERNAU)
KADRI (NORDLICHT/NORDSTURM, NORDKAP)
TALLINN (DITMAR KOEL)
PEET (FRAUENBURG)
ESTONIA
RAUNA (BRAUNSBERG)
KANDAVA (DUENA)
VENTA (UNDINE)
VOLGOLES (COLMAR)
MAGNITORSK (TROSTBURG)
ELTON (INSTERBURG)
KAGANOVICH (LIBAU)
KHAZAN (PALATIA)
JULIA (MEMELLAND/SEBU)
KOIDULA (UHLENHORST)
SIGRID (DETLEF)
HILDUR (RIMAGE)
KRIVS (ANTOINETTE)
AMATA (KARL)
GAUJA (FRIEDRICH)
AUSMA (KATHE O)
VALDONA (MEMELLAND/SUDETENLAND/BALTENLAND)
KAUPO (WESTPREUSSEN)
GUNDEGA (WEICHSELLAND)
EVERONIKA (IRMA)
ANDREJS KALNINS (RIGA/STADT RIGA)
ARIYA (WARTHELAND)
KULDIGA (PREUSSISCH-HOLLAND)
SPORTE (MAGDALENA)
DOLE (ANKE)
TAUTMILA (BALTENLAND)
EVERTONS (ROTERSAND)
KANGARS (MICHAEL)
AUSEKLIS (ORTLESBURG)

Abandoned during retreat and taken by Germany
VELTA (WALTER)
GROZNYI
AARNE (HEINRICH VON PLAUEN)

MB

User avatar
Dido
Member
Posts: 86
Joined: 03 Jan 2006, 22:53
Location: Greece

#174

Post by Dido » 07 Mar 2006, 11:01

BIGpanzer wrote:Hi, Dido! Have you read the info about "Iosif Stalin" passenger turboelectric ship you asked me for? I've posted the info especially for you (see my post from 23 February). Why no thanks?! :? :wink:
My deepest apologies BIGpanzer, sometimes I tend to ommit the obvious. :oops: :oops: No hard feeling I hope! I sure read it and it was most interesting. It would be great if there was a picture to see her condition after her abandonment.

User avatar
Dido
Member
Posts: 86
Joined: 03 Jan 2006, 22:53
Location: Greece

#175

Post by Dido » 07 Mar 2006, 11:27

Thank you both, were there any major (lets say above 3,000 grt) passenger ships among them?

Also concerning captured Soviet warships (destroyers and above) I understand that the following ships felt into German hands:

the destroyer Karl Marx was abandoned stranded following mine damage in the Gulf of Finland,
the destroyer Tbilis - I think- was bombed and left half sunk listing against the pier at Sevastopol,
the cruiser Chervona Ukraina was half sunk off Krimea.
the battleship Sovieskaya Ukraina was captured incomplete at the shipyard. The Germans removed some material to use in the constructions of two troopships, I think they were named Totilla and Teia.

It would be great if you could share any photos of the first three in their half-sunk condition.
Are there any other major warships that were left behind?
Do you have any information on those two troopships that were build at Nikolayev?

Best regards!

User avatar
BIGpanzer
Member
Posts: 2812
Joined: 12 Dec 2004, 23:51
Location: Central Europe

#176

Post by BIGpanzer » 07 Mar 2006, 11:42

Always glad to help, Dido! As for the photos of "Iosif Stalin" - I don't have them, unfortunately. I could only find post-WWII photos of the same type "Baltika".

Marty! Thanks a lot for the list.
I have the following info (completed list, according to Soviet archive data):
I. Soviet ships, were sunk or exploded by their crews in Soviet ports to prevent their capture by Germans

Baltic Sea:
1 "Silach", ice-breaker, 1200 hp, BGMP, exploded 24.06.1941 at Liepaja
2 "Mariampol", steamer, 1565 t, LGMP, sank 27.06.1941 at Riga
3 "Everiga", cargo steamer, 4648 t, LGMP, sank 03.07.41 at Pernau

Black Sea:
4 "Pskov", cargo steamer, 3549 t, ChGMP, sank 30.06.1941 at Odessa
5 "Orel", cargo steamer, 5152 t, ChGMP, sank 30.06.1941 at Odessa
6 "Plekhanov", cargo steamer, 3344 t, ChGMP, sank 30.06.1941 at Odessa
7 "Voikov", cargo steamer, 2052 t, ChGMP, sank 30.06.1941 at Odessa
8 "Petr Veliky", steamer, 7200 t, sank 30.06.1941 at Odessa
9 "Kharkov", cargo steamer, 6689 t, ChGMP, exploded 14.08.1941 at Nikolaev
10 "Volochaevka", cargo steamer, 3817 t, ChGMP, sank 18.08.1941 at Kherson
11 "Tovarishch", passenger ship, 2472 t, damaged by artillery fire and abandoned 08.10.1941 at Mariupol
12 "Grozny", diesel tanker, 4964 t, damaged by artillery fire 08.10.41 at Mariupol
13 "Volgo-Don", cargo steamer, 956 t, AGMP, exploded 08.10.1941 at Mariupol
14 Floating dock, 2000 t, exploded 08.10.1941 at Mariupol
15 "Georgy Sedov"/"Feodosia", cargo-passenger steamer, 1538 t, AGMP, exploded 12.10.1941 at Taganrog
16 "Berdyansk", cargo-passenger steamer, 151 passengers, DGMP(?), sank 12.10.1941 at Ejsk
17 "Chicherin", cargo-passenger ship, 1852 t, exploded 15.10.1941 at Odessa
18 "Adzharets", rescue ship, 200 t, exploded 15.10.1941 at Odessa
19 "Titan", coal-loader, 600 t, exploded 01.11.1941 at Feodosia
20 Floating dock, 4000 t, exploded 13.11.1941 at Kerch
21 "Nord", ice-breaking tug, 450 hp, AGMP (GISU ChF = hydrographic service of Black Sea Navy), exploded 20.08.1942 at Temrjuk

Some of those ships could be raised and repaired by Germans/Romanians

To be continued..........
Last edited by BIGpanzer on 07 Mar 2006, 15:28, edited 3 times in total.

User avatar
BIGpanzer
Member
Posts: 2812
Joined: 12 Dec 2004, 23:51
Location: Central Europe

#177

Post by BIGpanzer » 07 Mar 2006, 12:10

Dido wrote:
the destroyer Karl Marx was abandoned stranded following mine damage in the Gulf of Finland,
the destroyer Tbilis - I think- was bombed and left half sunk listing against the pier at Sevastopol,
the cruiser Chervona Ukraina was half sunk off Krimea.
the battleship Sovieskaya Ukraina was captured incomplete at the shipyard. The Germans removed some material to use in the constructions of two troopships, I think they were named Totilla and Teia.

It would be great if you could share any photos of the first three in their half-sunk condition.
Are there any other major warships that were left behind?
Do you have any information on those two troopships that were build at Nikolayev?
Dido, please, lets discuss warships in another thread!!! This thread is for civil transport ships. Please!!! :)
Sorry, but your info is not correct.
So very shortly:
1) AFAIK destroyer "Karl Max" was attacked by 4 German bombers 08.08.1941 at Loksa harbor, both engines were flooded because of close bomb explosions. The destroyer sank very closely to the shore and 11.08.1941 it was torpedoed by Soviet torpedo boats, completely destroyed. Parts were raised in 1962-1963 and scrapped in Tallinn.
2) AFAIK destroyer leader "Tbilisi" served at Pacific since 11.12.1940. Participated in Soviet-Japanese war in August 1945, never sank or damaged.
3) AFAIK cruiser "Chervona Ukraina" was attacked by 28 German dive bombers 12.11.1941 at pier (Sevastopol harbor), was directly hit by two bombs, also three bombs exploded very closely to the ship. Tne nose section of bilge was destroyed and in 16 hours the cruiser sank, 70 crewmembers were killed. Several 130mm guns from the cruiser was raised by Soviets and used as coastal defense guns, the cruiser was raised 03.11.1947 and reequipped as sea target.
4) AFAIK incompleted battleship "Sovetskaya Ukraina" (it was finished on 18%) was captured by Germans 15.08.1941. Hungarians partially took it to pieces. After liberation of Nikolaev by Soviet Army the incompleted ship was investigated (finished condition - 15%), but it could be finished soon as Germans exploded slipway before retreat. So the ship was scrapped.

User avatar
Dido
Member
Posts: 86
Joined: 03 Jan 2006, 22:53
Location: Greece

Re: German Seizures of Russian Ships

#178

Post by Dido » 07 Mar 2006, 13:03

Sorry for undeliberately going off topic but anyway thanks for the information.
mjbollinger wrote: Abandoned during retreat and taken by Germany
VELTA (WALTER)
GROZNYI
AARNE (HEINRICH VON PLAUEN)

MB
Is GROZNY the oil tanker that was built on the incomplete hull of the cruiser Admiral Spiridov? If I remember well she was seized at Mariopol by the Germans and was later scuttled, only to be raised again, hulked and scrapped sometime in the 50's. A most colourful career!

User avatar
BIGpanzer
Member
Posts: 2812
Joined: 12 Dec 2004, 23:51
Location: Central Europe

#179

Post by BIGpanzer » 07 Mar 2006, 14:00

Soviet diesel tanker/fueler "Grozny" (AGMP) was damaged by artillery fire at Mariupol 08.10.1941 and abandoned, probably, it was repaired by Germans later, but I don't have exact info.
As for incompleted Russian cruisers "Admiral Spiridov" and "Admiral Greig" (both of "Svetlana"-type, laid down in 1913, launched in 1916): they were rebuilt in 1924 as tankers "Grozneft" (by North Shipyard, Leningrad) and "Azneft" (by Baltic Shipyard, Leningrad), correspondingly. Cruiser "Chervona Ukraina" you've mentioned above was of the same type ("Svetlana"). The hulls of new tankers were equipped with several oil tanks, nose hold for dry cargos, two submarine diesels of "Russian diesel" plant. Armour belt was not removed. Both tankers were given in 1926 to the Oil State Company (Neftesindikat) and transferred to Black Sea. During that navigation both diesel ships were damaged by ice in Baltic Sea and moved to Germany for repair. Tankers "Grozneft" and "Azneft" were the first Soviet large diesel tankers, but they were not very good because of rebuilding from cruisers (some hull disadvantages were eleminated by Sevastopol Shipyard later, but many others remained - low speed, inefficient diesels). They were used as oil tankers between Black Sea and Mediterranean Sea ports in 1930s. Tanker "Grozny" you are interested in was indeed "Grozneft" (renamed in the mid1930s). "Azneft" sank in the end of 1936 near Tuapse (it was broken in two pieces during stormy weather after collision with harbor seawall).

Specifications: 5900 t full displacement; 158.4x15.3x7.9 m; 1100 Kw engines; 10.5 knots; 42 men crew.


Photos:
tanker "Azneft" on sea trials, 1927 - http://www.bz.ru/images/shazneft.jpg
cruiser "Chervona Ukraina" before WWII ("Svetlana"-type, two unfinished cruisers of the same type were reequipped into tankers "Grozneft" and "Azneft") -
http://foto.sevastopol.info/gallery/flo ... aina01.jpg
http://www.svrpu.ru/psv/3739/foto81.jpg
Last edited by BIGpanzer on 07 Mar 2006, 19:34, edited 4 times in total.

User avatar
BIGpanzer
Member
Posts: 2812
Joined: 12 Dec 2004, 23:51
Location: Central Europe

#180

Post by BIGpanzer » 07 Mar 2006, 15:21

"Velta" (steamer, 3100 t) from Latvian Shipping Company (LGMP) was abandoned at Liepaja port 27.06.1941 because the ship was under repair and couldn't go into the sea.
The same about "Aarne" (steamer, 2500 t) from Estonian Shipping Company (EGMP) - the ship was under repair and was abandoned 27.06.1941 at Ventspils port.
Interesting, that the largest ship of sunk/exploded by crews at Soviet ports - "Petr Veliky" (7200 t, sunk ot Odessa port) was not raised/repaired by Germans/Romanians, probably.

Post Reply

Return to “The Soviet Union at War 1917-1945”