Transport ships of USSR in 1941-1945 - any info!!

Discussions on all aspects of the USSR, from the Russian Civil War till the end of the Great Patriotic War and the war against Japan. Hosted by Art.
User avatar
BIGpanzer
Member
Posts: 2812
Joined: 12 Dec 2004 22:51
Location: Central Europe

Post by BIGpanzer » 06 Jan 2008 01:52

Thanks, Marty, but quite strange indeed that the ship was named "Khrushchev" in 1934. Also Miramar Ship Index has no any info about such a ship :roll:
1938 Wrecked 16.02.38 off Rybochii Peninsula at Cape Bargoutni
Do you have more details about the incident? That was Rybachii Peninsula on Barents Sea, also I am not very sure that you use the correct name for the Cape.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rybachy_Peninsula
http://www.biarmia.narod.ru/topo/kegor.htm
It should be mentioned that less than one month before (23.01.1938) another medium timber ship (“Rabochy”) was crushed by strong ice in Laptev Sea.

Regards, BP

kgvm
Member
Posts: 408
Joined: 12 Jul 2007 20:14
Location: Hannover, Germany

Post by kgvm » 07 Jan 2008 11:58

The ship is mentioned in R. González Echegaray, la marina mercante y el tráfico maítimo en la guerra civil, on page 277, too. Spelling there: KHRUSCHEV
And the copy from Lloyd's Register with the mentioning of the loss:
http://www.plimsollshipdata.org/pdffile ... 8b0478.pdf
I assume, if you play long enough with all the possible ways of spelling you should find the ship in miramarships, too :)

And - you're accustomed to it - a link to a picture:
Lettonian "Kalpaks" of 1914 as French "Marie Louise", very probably taken in the Kiel Canal:
http://www.shipsnostalgia.com/gallery// ... hoto=95612

Regards
Klaus Günther

User avatar
BIGpanzer
Member
Posts: 2812
Joined: 12 Dec 2004 22:51
Location: Central Europe

Post by BIGpanzer » 07 Jan 2008 14:39

kgvm wrote:
The ship is mentioned in R. González Echegaray, la marina mercante y el tráfico maítimo en la guerra civil, on page 277, too. Spelling there: KHRUSCHEV
And the copy from Lloyd's Register with the mentioning of the loss:
http://www.plimsollshipdata.org/pdffile ... 8b0478.pdf
I assume, if you play long enough with all the possible ways of spelling you should find the ship in miramarships, too
Thanks for the info, Klaus. I played long enough :wink: For example, I tried to find "Khrushchev" in Miramar several times, using the common for different spellings word fragment "hrus" but that gave nothing close to Soviet-built medium timber ship. Interesting, that there is no any info about that unknown steamer in Russian sources also except the interview of ex-sailor from "Nikita Khrushchev" about the transport actions during the Spanish Civil war I mentioned above.
Stop, I found it in Miramar under the name KRUSHCHEV which is not correct spelling, of course. The databese mentions that the ship wrecked off Rabochiy Peninsula 16.02.1938 also. Was it crashed by ice? Interesting, how nhp (IIRC nominal horsepower to estimate the power of steam engines in XIX c.) corresponds with usual hp - Lloyds mentions 147 NHP for "Khrushchev" whereas modern reference-books give 950 hp for that type of cargo ships.
Marty wrote:
1934 Completed as KHRUSHCHEV (SGMP)
1936 KHRUSCHEV (BGMP)
No mistake here? Lloyd mentions Arkhangelsk as home port for "Khrushchev" and those timber ships were developed for the route Arkhangelsk-London indeed, the steamer wrecked in Barents Sea also. But BGMP means Baltic State Steamship Company whereas SGMP means North State Steamship Company - I guess the ship should belong to SGMP.
P.S. The use of "Khrushchev" in Mediterranean and Black Seas (routes from Odessa to Italy) according to the memoires of ex-sailor is not a problem as those medium timber ships were planned to use there initially (transportation of grain during the winter time).

Regards, BP

kgvm
Member
Posts: 408
Joined: 12 Jul 2007 20:14
Location: Hannover, Germany

Post by kgvm » 07 Jan 2008 17:43

Just one additional remark:
I don't believe the ship was named after Nikita K., he was not ranking that high in 1934. I suppose you have to google once more to find which man (or woman) the ship was named for!

Regards
Klaus Günther

User avatar
BIGpanzer
Member
Posts: 2812
Joined: 12 Dec 2004 22:51
Location: Central Europe

Post by BIGpanzer » 07 Jan 2008 19:19

kgvm wrote:
Just one additional remark:
I don't believe the ship was named after Nikita K., he was not ranking that high in 1934. I suppose you have to google once more to find which man (or woman) the ship was named for!
That is why I opened this question (see above) about "Khrushchev" (for example, there were "Stalin", "Krasin", "Mikoyan", "Uritsky", "Volodarsky", "Kuibyshev" among those steamers)! For me it seems quite strange that timber ship was named after Nikita Khrushchev in 1934 who was just the first secretary of Moscow commitee of Bolshevist Party in 1934-1938. But...Moscow commitee was the important organization because the status of capital, so...perhaps. At least this representative photo from 1937 is known (N. Khrushchev to the left) - http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/e ... Moscow.jpg

Regards, BP

mjbollinger
Member
Posts: 238
Joined: 14 Sep 2005 01:23
Location: Great Falls, VA

Post by mjbollinger » 09 Jan 2008 04:04

BP / KGVM,

You are of course correct. My typing is not good and sometimes I just revert ot English. It is Cape Bargoutny on the Rybachii peninsula.

It does not surprise me that Khrushchev was used as a ship's name in 1934. The Soviets were adding merchant ships like crazy in 1934 and they probably had to dig deep for names. First Secretary of the Moscow Communist Party would seem to qualify him.

MB

MB

User avatar
BIGpanzer
Member
Posts: 2812
Joined: 12 Dec 2004 22:51
Location: Central Europe

Post by BIGpanzer » 09 Jan 2008 13:19

Marty wrote:
It does not surprise me that Khrushchev was used as a ship's name in 1934. The Soviets were adding merchant ships like crazy in 1934 and they probably had to dig deep for names. First Secretary of the Moscow Communist Party would seem to qualify him.
There was only one Communist Party in USSR, Khrushchev was the First Secretary of its Moscow Committee :)
As for the 1934 - yes, that was the period of large scale industrialization and socialistic competitions between ports, shipyards and steamship companies, Soviet sea transport increased cargo turnover in 3.9 times in comparison with 1928, the role of merchant ships in the Soviet economy increased a lot also. IIRC Soviet merchant fleet received around 140 ships (500.000 brt) in the first half of 1930s, a lot of ports were modernized (Leningrad, Murmansk, Odessa, Kherson, Novorossisk, Sukhumi, Vladivostok, etc.).
For example, in 1934 - diesel ship "KIM" from ChGMP performed the first run to USA (Odessa - New York) and opened the regular routes between both countries after establishing of diplomatic relations; the same year the Central Agency "Inflot" for service of foreign ships in Soviet ports was established; the same year the Central office of merchant fleet (TsUMORFLOT) was established as well as eight sea steamship companies; the same year the first navigations along the Northern Sea Route began.

Regards, BP

mjbollinger
Member
Posts: 238
Joined: 14 Sep 2005 01:23
Location: Great Falls, VA

Post by mjbollinger » 09 Jan 2008 22:55

Here's what I've calculated on the number of ships over 900GRT that entered the Soviet merchant fleet in the early 1930s.



1930: 32
1931: 24
1932: 37
1933: 31
1934: 29
1935: 52

MB

User avatar
BIGpanzer
Member
Posts: 2812
Joined: 12 Dec 2004 22:51
Location: Central Europe

Post by BIGpanzer » 10 Jan 2008 09:28

Thanks, Marty!

The fates of large timber ships of "Volgoles"-type (built by Admiralty and North shipyards in Leningrad in 1932-1934) according to Miramar Ship Index. We've discussed those cargo diesel ships (8130 tons) a lot here. The most famous of them was "Stary bolshevik" [from Murmansk Sea Steamship Company] which repulsed ~47 attacks of German bombers/torpedo-bombers during run in convoy PQ-16 (the ship transported aircraft, air bombs, artillery shells, explosions and barrels of aircraft fuel), was heavily damaged by air bomb [one AA gun on forecastle was destroyed, four artillerymen of another were wounded, diesel and rudder control were damaged] but the ship was repaired during 8 hours by crew who fought also the large fire almost reached the hold No.1 with explosives at the open sea under strong enemy attacks [one bomber was shot down and another was damaged] and successfully arrived to Murmansk.

"Komiles" performed very well during large convoy PQ-18 of 40 ships, where that Soviet ship leaded the 2nd column and transported 27 aircraft, 35 tanks, 1000 tons of ammunition, 700 tons of fuel in barrels. "Komiles" avoided two torpedos and four bombs by skillful manoeuvring (noted in the report of British convoy command). The crew of "Komiles" claimed that two enemy bombers were shot down during air attacks (IIRC 80 torpedo-bombers and 130 bombers attacked the convoy).

Also reequipment of four ships of that type from Far-East State Steamship Company for transportation of locomotives from USA to USSR through Pacific was the well-known page of the WWII history of those ships.

http://ntic.msun.ru/ntic/exhibition/fes ... f679_1.jpg (famous "Stary bolshevik", I guess that after post-WWII modernization)
http://ntic.msun.ru/ntic/exhibition/fes ... f354_1.jpg ["Clara Zetkin" reequipped for transportation of 18 locomotives with tenders on the deck and in the holds during WWII]

_____________________________________________________________________________________

"Volgoles" - torpedoed off Kirkenes 19.08.1944 [German "Colmar" since 1941]

"Dvinoles" - collision 04.02.1942 in the point 47.14'/50.44'

"Komiles" - wrecked in 1948 on the way Vladivostok - Petropavlovsk-Kamchatski

"Sevzaples" - utilized 10.01.1972

"Kuznets Lesov" [laid down as "Severoles"] - torpedoed by submarine 23.11.1942 in the point 75.30'/08.00'

"Maksim Gorky" (laid down as "Exportles") - utilized 23.12.1971

"Clara Zetkin" - utilized in 1975

"Vtoraya pyatiletka" (laid down as "Lesbel") - bombed by aircraft 30.08.1941 in the point 60.04'/26.44'

"Stary bolshevik" - utilized 15.01.1970

"Ivan Papanin" (laid down as "Murmanles", "Uralles" since 1933, "Karl Lepin" since 1935) - bombed by aircraft 29.08.1941 near Hogland Is.

Ore-carriers [the same type of ships, reequiped by Nikolaev shipyard in the end of 1930s]

"Polina Osipenko" - bombed by aircraft 13.08.1941 in the point 46.36'/31.04'

"Anatoly Serov" - mined near Sevastopol 08.04.1949

Regards, BP
Last edited by BIGpanzer on 11 Jan 2008 00:20, edited 5 times in total.

User avatar
BIGpanzer
Member
Posts: 2812
Joined: 12 Dec 2004 22:51
Location: Central Europe

Post by BIGpanzer » 10 Jan 2008 17:50

Some info I could find about armament (data for 01.1943) of large timber ships of "Volgoles"-type from Far-East State Sea Steamship Company (DGMP) which were used in Arctic: "Komiles" (31 men crew + 14 men of armed guard, 1x76mm + 4x20mm + 2 MGs, armed in Arkhangelsk and UK); "Kuznets Lesov" (32 men crew + 9 men of armed guard, 5 MGs, armed in Vladivostok and USA).

"Stary bolshevik" from MGMP (Murmansk) was armed with 3 guns, 4 20mm Oerlikons and 2 "Maxim" MGs during PQ-16 (see above).

The first Soviet merchant ship in Arctic which shot down enemy aircraft (Ju 88 from II/KG30, tactical number 4D + IK) was the ship of "Volgoles"-type also - that was done 13.03.1942 54 miles from Murmansk by "Sevzaples" during PQ-12 run. AFAIK British mine-sweeper "Stefa" (ex-whalecatcher) from convoy escort also laid a claim for this victory (both ships fired together against that attacking bomber).

Regards, BP

User avatar
BIGpanzer
Member
Posts: 2812
Joined: 12 Dec 2004 22:51
Location: Central Europe

Post by BIGpanzer » 12 Jan 2008 23:47

As for the loss of "Volgoles". That timber carrier was captured by Germans 22.06.1941 in Stettin, the Soviet crew was arrested. Renamed as "Colmar" and the ship was sunk 19.08.1944 in the point 70.13'/31.04' (58 men were lost) during the attack of 14 Soviet motor torpedo boats of the North Navy against German convoy near Cape Kibergness. The same day Soviet submarine M-2-1 detected 50-60 pressed hay bales, 3 water kegs and empty life-boat with the inscription "Colmar" on board.

Regards, BP

kgvm
Member
Posts: 408
Joined: 12 Jul 2007 20:14
Location: Hannover, Germany

Post by kgvm » 14 Jan 2008 11:09

Well after some searching for the new place of this thread ...
Some links again, (may be I have posted one or the other already, but I didn't want to compare all my old postings :) )
http://www.navsource.org/archives/12/172888.htm (Lermontov of 1918)
http://www.navsource.org/archives/12/173002.htm (Tashkent von 1911)
http://www.navsource.org/archives/12/171628.htm (Ural of 1901)
http://www.navsource.org/archives/12/174523.htm (Kapitan Smirnov of 1913)
http://www.navsource.org/archives/12/171954.htm (Jan Tomp of 1912)
http://www.navsource.org/archives/12/173695.htm (Belorussia von 1918)
http://www.navsource.org/archives/12/171365.htm (Mikhail Lomonosov of 1902)
http://www.navsource.org/archives/12/173813.htm (Briansk/Tallinn of 1918)
http://www.navsource.org/archives/09/46/46214.htm (Varlaam Avanesov of 1920, photo added 11.01.08)
http://www.navsource.org/archives/12/172526.htm (Donbass of 1917-18)
http://www.navsource.org/archives/12/173882.htm (Zyrianin of 1912)
http://www.riverseaships.co.uk/memories/djurma1921.htm (Djurma of 1921)
http://www.shipsnostalgia.com/gallery// ... hoto=97094 (Feliks Dzerzhinskij of 1926)

Regards
Klaus Günther

Klaus from Russia
Member
Posts: 4
Joined: 20 Jan 2008 21:32
Location: Russia

Post by Klaus from Russia » 20 Jan 2008 22:07

Good day.
Some info about METALLIST photo from Rover's site.
http://www.wlb-stuttgart.de/seekrieg/39-08.htm
M. Morozov says, that is german LEANDER, 1925, 989grt, later EMPIRE CRUSADER.
He says, that fhoto made 11.1939, at Vigo bay, Spain, before blockaderunning to Germany. Hard misspelling russian name is camouflage.
What you think about this? Is 989grt too small for ship in that photo? I don't find any photo of this ship.
Excuse me for my terrible English. And thank you for many interesting things about our steamers :)

Klaus from Russia
Member
Posts: 4
Joined: 20 Jan 2008 21:32
Location: Russia

Post by Klaus from Russia » 20 Jan 2008 22:19

And photo of METALLIST that some closer to truth (from estonian diving site)
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

kgvm
Member
Posts: 408
Joined: 12 Jul 2007 20:14
Location: Hannover, Germany

Post by kgvm » 21 Jan 2008 11:30

I think, you are right, the picture shows the German "Leander".
The way of writing is unusual, the pictures of Sovet ships I know have the Kyrillic name in bolder writing at the top and the Latin translation in smaller letters. And German sources confirm, that "Leander" was camouflaged as "Metallist", homeport Kerch, for the intended run home.
Regards
Klaus Günther

Return to “The Soviet Union at War 1917-1945”