Himmler's white collar tabs

Jolly Man · #1

On page 46, pic.#60 in Mollo's "Pictorial History of the SS" shows the photo of Himmler with Gestapo Chief Diels in 1934. In the photo, Himmler wears WHITE collar tabs. I've never seen these tabs in any other photo of HH. Was this a VERY short lived SS insignia. I'll have to say they do look good on the black uniform.

Jolly

Mark Costa · #2

Himmler seems to have worn these for only a month or two in January/February 1934. No one is sure exactly what these represent. There are several photos of him wearing these at a rally meeting as well and a photo of him walking in Berlin with Karl Wolff. It is also possible that these in fact are light CARMINE which would represent his attachment to the SA Reichsfuhrung, but that is only speculation. No documentation exists on these and believe me, I have looked!!!

Mark Costa

Jolly Man · #3

Thanks Mark, the SA connection sounds quite logical. Perhaps this was to show the SAs authority over the SS, until June 30th 1934 that is.

Runar · #4

SS-leaders attached to the Oberste SA Führung wore carmine collar patches and shoulder strap underlay. This practice was abolished after the Röhm-Putsch due to the SS being given status as an independent organization, thus no attachments to the OSAF.
White collar patches were used by Himmler, and some of his "personal staff" officers from June to August 1934.

Best regards
Runar

Mark Costa · #5

Runar:

I have to diagree with you on the time of wear of these white tabs. The photos that I have seen also show Röhm and are either late 1933 or very early 1934. Photos of Himmler taken just before the Röhm purge in June of 1934 already show him wearing the black Obergruppenführer tabs.

Mark Costa

Derek · #6

I agree with Mr. Costa, there is no photographic evdence of the white patches being worn outside of the winter '33/34 period. The supposition that this was interim insignia after the emasculation of the SA is not supported by evidence. The patches, from close-up photographs, are definitely white. I too am searching for material to explain these badges.
Sincerely,
Derek

Runar · #7

OK. My source is "Uniforms of the SS" by Andrew Mollo. However, I know that there are much uncertainty about this. It would make sense if the white collar patches were worn from the days of the Röhm-purge untill the special Reichsführer-SS and SA Stabschef collar patches were introduced in August 1934. But if there exists photographic evidence that they are worn before the Röhm-purge, I stand corrected - and appriciate the information.

Best regards
Runar

eagles nest · #8

can anyone post pictures?

Nila MadhaVa · #9

id like to second that...can someone please post pics

babyblue · #10

i've got a nice one here in colour....i'm probably way off track...but thought might show you guys anyway, since it's in colour and of him scratching his leg lol

GMB · #11

Nice pic!

A question: Isn´t there a bit too much "bling-bling" on his fingers? 2 more rings (beside the marriage-rings on his right) on his left hand?

Who knows what kind of rings those are?

Regards

GMB

Karl1 · #12

GMB wrote:Nice pic!

A question: Isn´t there a bit too much "bling-bling" on his fingers? 2 more rings (beside the marriage-rings on his right) on his left hand?

Who knows what kind of rings those are?

Regards

GMB

Hahahaha: BLING-BLING Rapper Heinrich!

!!! Well I thought Himmler didn't wore his wedding ring anymore after a while, cause of the bad marriage thing with Marga. One of his rings must be the honor ring and they other one I thought a black seal ring.

Does anybody know more about this?

Luft300 · #13

It would be interesting to find out what happened to all of his uniforms. Only one, the white tunic, has ever been found and is in the collection of David Delich. I've seen his medal bar, which was being offered for sale by Hardin & Wolfe a number of years ago at one of the MAX Shows in Monroeville. I've also seen his SS Honor Dagger a couple of times - or at least one of them. A few years ago somebody came up with one of his Waffen-SS uniforms and claimed it came from one of Himmler's secretaries, who had it squirreled away all these years, but upon closer inspection it turned out to be a Janke reproduction with museum-quality reproduction insignia. So what happened to the Reichs-Heini's uniforms? Are they lurking in somebody's attic?

Luft300

Runar · #14

Here one can see Robert Bergmann with carmine collar patches and "Oberste SA Führung" cufftitle. Hopefully someone has a picture of Himmler with white collar patches. As for Himmlers uniforms, I am certain that there are more than one surviving the war. Probably in somebodys collection. I have heard rumors. A norwegian collector supposedly has, or has had one field grey tunic and cap originally belonging to Himmler.

Best regards
Runar

General Heinrich · #15

I am also interested to know what rings he wore. I am trying to find out but to no avail. So what are those "bling blings"? Hehehe