Full German Officers Name in Ottoman Army..

Discussions on the final era of the Ottoman Empire, from the Young Turk Revolution of 1908 until the Treaty of Lausanne in 1923.
Tosun Saral
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Re: Full German Officers Name in Ottoman Army..

Post by Tosun Saral » 31 May 2019 20:11

Fieldmarshal Liman von Sanders Pasha wrote in his book Fünf Jahre Türkei" that there were only 500 german COs, NCOs and men on the Gallipoli Front.
My note: They were mostly heavy artillerists at the Dardanelles forts.

Pomiankowski the military representative of K.u.k army ay İstanbul wrote in his book that tere were at least 5000 germans all over Turkish empire. and of which 500 at Gallipoli
2000 germans working at munition production.
1500 neval personal
1500 workers producing munition for the navy
150 artillerists 0f 12 cm battery
prussian enginers at gallipoli
crew of 15 cmhowitzer battery at palestine

stevebecker
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Re: Full German Officers Name in Ottoman Army..

Post by stevebecker » 07 Jun 2019 00:36

Mate,

The MG groups from the German Naval ships (SMS Goeben & Breslau) were first under Ltdz Boltz and around 44 men and 8 MG's were rushed to the Helles front in early May 1915 following the landings.

Further Germans MG groups were added due to the lack of Ottoman MGs at the front.

Other then the odd German on Ottoman staff these were the only Germans untill late in the year when the German Reinforcments arrived, like the Pioneer Group and the Austrian Artillery.

As stated there were German gunnery officers and men in some of the Dardenells defences, these came from the two German ships and only helped the Ottoman soldiers also manning the defences.

German officers and men also helped as crew in Ottoman ships and other parts of the Ottoman navy, as Army officers help the Ottoman Army, like wise the Ottoman Airforce was just forming and the first Sqn/Company was training by Germans.

I am unaware of the numbers of Germans in the Arms industry in the Ottoman Empire, but I'll take those figures shown untill other details turn up.

So Germans had been part of the Ottoman Empire for years, while the latest Group under Sanders had been there for around a year.

I hope that helps as a very basic outline of the Germans at the Dardenells in early 1915

S.B

Edward L. Hsiao
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Re: Full German Officers Name in Ottoman Army..

Post by Edward L. Hsiao » 08 Jun 2019 00:50

Gentlemen,

Thank you for your good detailed answers so far of the German military men that were working with the Ottoman Empire armed forces at the battlefields and at sea during WWI.

Edward L. Hsiao

stevebecker
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Re: Full German Officers Name in Ottoman Army..

Post by stevebecker » 08 Jun 2019 23:41

Mate,

Sorry I should have added that the Germans were not there to fight, but to Train and provide technical aid to the Ottoman Armed Forces. Other then those officers on Staff appointments or combat ships.

But as the war on these Germans came into contact more often and there Technical services were needed .

But these German continued to train the Ottoman forces during the war, while new German combat units were later sent to help.

But by far the most help came in the form of technical from services like the Signals and Transport (Railways) and officer training (as there was little to no education below the officer level, and many young officers were poorly educated, most if not all soldiers had to learn to use the modern weapons and equiptment).

As stated I don't have any references to aid to the Arms or other industries so what help came I am unsure.

S.B

Tosun Saral
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Re: Full German Officers Name in Ottoman Army..

Post by Tosun Saral » 04 Aug 2019 09:55

A German radio station at Damascus
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Edward L. Hsiao
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Re: Full German Officers Name in Ottoman Army..

Post by Edward L. Hsiao » 19 Aug 2019 08:03

Do you anything about Karl Schneider who was born on 10 August 1881. He was part of the staff of the Sonderkommando der Kaiserlichen Marine in der Turkei during World War I in 1915 to 1918. He was a Korvettenkapitan (Full Commander). Held Turkish army rank of Oberstleutnant. What kind of full military career did Schneider had. What decorations did Schneider won from Germany and Turkey?

Do you know anything about Korvettenkapitan Wolfram Knorr who was captain of Breslau a German light cruiser. Did he held a Turkish army rank as well? He was captain of the German raider Meteor. What decorations did Knorr won from Germany and Turkey? Were his cruises of the Breslau productive during WWI? He never won the Pour le Merite.

Edward L. Hsiao

Tosun Saral
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Re: Full German Officers Name in Ottoman Army..

Post by Tosun Saral » 20 Aug 2019 11:59

Georg v. Hippel captain of Midilli sunk at Saros Bay
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stevebecker
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Re: Full German Officers Name in Ottoman Army..

Post by stevebecker » 20 Aug 2019 22:27

Mate,

I have these men by that name, possibly;

Schneider Karl Kapt-Lt Naval observer Airforce staff officer to Admiral Usedom att 1st Sqn Tayyare Boluk 3-15 later possibly German Seaplane Sqn (Wasserfliegerabteilung) shown on patrol with Capt Serno to Tenedos 17-3-15 made first reccon flight in Rumpler B1 over Gallipoli

The only other Schniedier's are

Schneider LtCol Naval Bogazlar Deniz Özel birliklerinde Amirallik kurmay subayi (Bogazlar Marine Special troops Admiral officer)

Schneider Peter Valentin Pte Naval unknown (died 9-3-14) grave at Tarabya Istanbul

Schneider ObLt Istanbul'da emir subayi (Order subscribers in Istanbul)

I hope he is here?

As to the other man I show him as

Knorr Wolfram von Maj Naval Midilli (Breslau) zirhlisinin komutani (Commander of Midilli (Breslau) armory)

I show is Ottoman Rank as Maj

as to

Hippel Georg von Capt (Col) Naval Midilli (Breslau) zirhlisinin komutani (Commander of Midilli (Breslau) armory) last commander of the Midilli (Breslau) 1917-1918 sunk at Saros Bay

I show his Ottoman rank as Col

S.B

Tosun Saral
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Re: Full German Officers Name in Ottoman Army..

Post by Tosun Saral » 22 Aug 2019 12:01

1-Schneider LtCol Naval Bogazlar Deniz Özel birliklerinde Amirallik kurmay subayi (Bogazlar Marine Special troops Admiral officer)
right translation: Naval Staff officer at the Marine Special troops of both straits.


2- Schneider ObLt Istanbul'da emir subayi (Order subscribers in Istanbul)
Aide-de-camp (emir subayı) in Istanbul

stevebecker
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Re: Full German Officers Name in Ottoman Army..

Post by stevebecker » 22 Aug 2019 23:03

Tosun,

Thanks, Google translation does not always follow the finer points of Turkish speak.

I did notice that Hippel is shown buried at the garden of German Embassy at Tarabya/Istanbul

Was he killed or died later after the sinking of the Midilli 20th Jan 1918?

One of a number of crew members buried at the garden of German Embassy at Tarabya/Istanbul

S.B

Tosun Saral
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Re: Full German Officers Name in Ottoman Army..

Post by Tosun Saral » 23 Aug 2019 19:31

Fritz Dobberstein - 1.Tayyare Bölüğü astsubay başçavuş.
Fritz Dobberstein - 1.Flight Sqr Master sergeant Turkish Army
source: Tolga Alkan
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Tosun Saral
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Re: Full German Officers Name in Ottoman Army..

Post by Tosun Saral » 23 Aug 2019 19:39

Georg Bock von Wülfingen Paşa Osmanlı Menziller Müfettişi Haziran 1918
Georg Bock von Wülfingen Paşa Inspector General of Ottoman Etages, ranges
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stevebecker
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Re: Full German Officers Name in Ottoman Army..

Post by stevebecker » 24 Aug 2019 00:17

Tosun,

I notice another man by that name is shown in Ottoman Service?

Wülfingen Ferdinand Bock von ObLt to Capt Artillery (1883-1956) Artillery later WWII LtGen admin comds

He looks like a Brother of Georg?

Cheers

S.B

Edward L. Hsiao
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Re: Full German Officers Name in Ottoman Army..

Post by Edward L. Hsiao » 26 Aug 2019 01:17

Who was the commander of the German battlecruiser Groeben during 1917 and 1918?

Edward L. Hsiao

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