Stange

Discussions on the final era of the Ottoman Empire, from the Young Turk Revolution of 1908 until the Treaty of Lausanne in 1923.
NikosV
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Post by NikosV » 06 May 2007 03:46

From the Edward J. Erickson article posted in this thread http://www.meforum.org/article/991:
"But accusations of genocide demand authentic proof of an official policy of ethnic extermination. Vahakn Dadrian has made high-profile claims that Major Stange and the Special Organization were the instruments of ethnic cleansing and genocide. Documents not utilized by Dadrian, though, discount such an allegation."
Contrast his conclusion to the following:
According to a newspaper report of 20 May 1919, Suleyman Faik Pa§a, deputy commander of the Second Army Corps in the Harput region and former lieutenant gove: nor of Harput, was still in possession of the document containing Mahmut Kamil Pa§a's order to eliminate all Armenians.138 Corroborating evidence is provided in a report by German officer Stange, who claimed that Faik Pa§a told him he had received deportation order-from Kamil Pa§a. The massacres in the region, Stange reported, were coordinated by Hilmi Bey, the Unionist "inspector," Bahaettin §akir Bey, and Seyfullah Bey, deputy for Erzurum (the three of them worling on behalf of the party), as well as by Hulusi Bey, the police chief and Mahmut Kamil Pa§a.139
138.Renaissance and Journal d' Orient, 6 April 1919, and Renaissance, 1 May 1919.
139. PA-AA(German Foreign Office, Political Archive [also appears as DE/PA-AA])/Bo. Kons./B. 170, Report by Stange, dated 23 August 1915.

Akcam, Taner; trans. Paul Bessemer. A Shameful Act: The Armenian Genocide and the Question of Turkish Responsibility Henry Holt and Company (New York, 2006) p. 172.

Again the Erickson article makes no use of German archives. The Dadrian article mentions Erickson relies on translations and Turkish military connections. Instead Erickson presents his sources and the way he obtained them as a new method to deny the Armenian genocide in that article.

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Peter H
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Post by Peter H » 06 May 2007 05:38

The topic here is Stange.

You obviously can't understand our guideline here on the Armenians as posted by the owner of this forum or you wish to ignore it.

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=116410

Discussions on the Armenians can be found in our H&WC section.Take up your views there.

Tosun Saral
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Post by Tosun Saral » 06 May 2007 09:20

Suleyman Faik Pasha was the second Grand Master of Turkish Masons. After the armistrace he was arrested by British and deported to Malta on July 13th 1920 with other Turkish noble and brave Generals and statemen. His deportation numbers is List B nr:2807. He was accused for mishandling Turkish Christians at East of Turkey. The Turkish deportants were trialed in an Allied Court established according to the article nr:230 of the Treaty of Sevres. After trial he was found unquilty and released with other Turks. The most importand evidence that made him unquilty is a letter of British High Commissionar's letter to London. In this letter High Commisioner stated that there are only fabrications and sayings without any proof.

The deportants of Malta were released on Oct 25th 1921. They set foot on the holly soil of Vaterland in Istanbul for whom they fougt at many fronts for more then 10 years at Oct. 30.1921.

Most of them joined to the National Forces of Mustafa Kemal.

May the resting place of that noble and brave men be light.
So mote it be!

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Peter H
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Post by Peter H » 06 May 2007 09:32

I'm locking this topic.

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Peter H
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Post by Peter H » 11 Jan 2008 14:41

Thanks to Glenn for his great help and research here.

His findings after much effort:

"WILHELM Stange....received the Red Eagle Order 4th Class with Crown on 27 January 1910."

Wolfgang Klaus
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Post by Wolfgang Klaus » 14 Jan 2008 23:53

I guess everything said about Major Christian August Stange but here is a picture - even it's not a very good one. As far as I read he died in 1918 due to a gas attack at the Westfront.
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Wolfgang Klaus
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Post by Wolfgang Klaus » 15 Jan 2008 00:00

But there was another Stange in Turkey, who was discribed by Torsun. He was in Erzerum and at the end of his deployment commander of the Turkish artillery school. Unfortunately I don't know, if the picture is him or the above mentioned Christian August Stange - sorry but probably somebody can help.

Regards

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Peter H
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Post by Peter H » 15 Jan 2008 04:09

Two Stange's as per here:

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=107127

19.Yarbay Stange (1) İstanbul'da Piyade Alay komutanı İstanbul'da yedekbirliklerin Müfetttişi

32.Binbaşı Stange (2) Edirne'de Topçu Subayı Lazistan Çete Birlikleri Komutanı

Stange:
According to Prof. Dr.Tank Staff Col.Ismet Görgülü " On Yıllık Harbin Kadrosu 1912-1922" (Personal of Ten Years Long War)

p.105 : Lt. Col. Stange Commander of Artillary Fortress Erzurum in 1914 [Görgülü got this information from German Lt. Col. Gurze's article translated into Turkish in Askeri Mecmua no 79, s.18 (Military Magazine Nr. 79, p.18)on 1931 "Büyük Harbte Kafkas Cephesindeki Muharebeler (Battles in Caucasus Front During Great War),

p.109: Units of North and South Wings
-Stange Detachment (Stange Müfrezesi) commanded by Lt. Col. Stange (This Müfreze was also known as 8th Inf. Reg.) Stange was nicknamede by Turks as İbrahim Bey [Görgülü got this information from "Gen. Fahri Belen "Birinci Dünya Harbinde Türk Harbi 1914 Yılı Hareketleri s.142 "Turkish War During WW1 Operation in 1914 p.142)

Tosun Saral
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Post by Tosun Saral » 15 Jan 2008 11:23

Wolfgang Klaus wrote:I guess everything said about Major Christian August Stange but here is a picture - even it's not a very good one. As far as I read he died in 1918 due to a gas attack at the Westfront.

The uniform which he wears is 1912 granddress. This means that he was serving in Turkish Army during Balkan War and after. The appolettes were removed after Balkan War according to German muster.

Tosun Saral
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Re: Stange

Post by Tosun Saral » 31 Mar 2018 09:51

Miralay/ Oberst Christian August Stange Bey
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