Deutschlandlied (Deutschland, Deutschland über alles...)

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qristian
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Deutschlandlied (Deutschland, Deutschland über alles...)

Post by qristian » 27 Aug 2004 22:54

during the war the allies, as a part of their propaganda campaign, they say the deutschland deutschland über alles song meant that germans were better than other people and races and that germany should go to war to expand their reich on the cost of "subhumans" -germany germany over all-
but the song was made in the 17-1800 and that was when all the states like bavaria and sachsen and preussia was connecting to make òne german state therby -germany germany instead of many states where the people was the same- germany germany above something else

but still the pathetic germans wont dare to say anything about the many hidden facts of ww2 or anything positive about their history

i just needed to say that

[Topic renamed by the host, Ivan Ž.]

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HaEn
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Post by HaEn » 28 Aug 2004 04:12

"Deutschland Deutschland über alles" simply meant "i prefer my country over all the others". It had nothing to do with ruling others, or being "over" people. HN

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Geli
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Post by Geli » 28 Aug 2004 04:56

qristian wrote:the song was made in the 17-1800 and that was when all the states like bavaria and sachsen and preussia was connecting to make òne german state therby -germany germany instead of many states where the people was the same-

Actually, that's an interesting point, especially from an American perspective, since it renders Deutschland über alles similar to the motto "E Pluribus Unum" (one from many) which is on every US Dollar bill.

varjag
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Post by varjag » 28 Aug 2004 11:26

There was a debate about a proper translation of 'über alles' several months ago on the forum. There were some very good proposals but even splitting my brain - I cannot remember them. HaEn is quite right - it has nothing to do with ruling all others. But the British propaganda machine early on, picked the simple translation über = over for it's theme of an entire world under threat of the nazi jackboot - and that stuck, appearently to this day.

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Post by ohrdruf » 29 Aug 2004 00:57

The point about the now disallowed first verse of the former German national anthem is that it makes a military political statement which it had been the purpose of the Second World War to reverse, and involved areas which by that defeat Germany had finally relinquished.

Deutschland, Deutschland, ueber alles
- Germany, Germany, before everything
Ueber alles in der Welt
- Before everything in the world
Wenn es steht zu Schutz und Truetze
- Whenever we are on the defensive or attacking
Bruederlich zusammenhaelt!
- As brothers we stand together.

Von der Maas bis an die Memel
- From the Meuse to the Memel
Von der Etsch bis an den Belt
- From the Adige to the Belt
Deutschland, Deutschland, etc.

In the second stanza, the Memel is an area forfeited under the Treaty of Versailles which had been re-annexed by Hitler in 1939 and subsequently became part of the then Soviet bloc. The Adige is a river in northern Italy and suggests that Austria and the North Tyrol are German. They may be in part racially German but post-1945 Germany no longer laid claim to them.

The decision to discard the first verse was made on political grounds which bear scrutiny.

Ohrdruf

varjag
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Post by varjag » 29 Aug 2004 13:37

Ohrdruf is quite right - but it was mainly that bit about 'Memel' that was too much to stomach for the postwarians. Meanwhile - it is noted that German interest and influence in - the Kaliningrad Enclave - is considerable. Everything can change in this world - as Stalin said....

Claymore
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Post by Claymore » 26 Dec 2004 18:45

I have scanned a postcard used in 1941

Deutschland, Deutschland uber alles.jpg
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Ivan Ž.
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Post by Ivan Ž. » 14 Jun 2006 14:09

Nice songcard, Ian :)

Cheers,
Ivan

cultersheep
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Re: Deutschlandlied (Deutschland, Deutschland über alles...)

Post by cultersheep » 19 Oct 2019 02:30

https://s1.vocaroo.com/media/download_t ... 1NEUPU.mp3

That is the best version I've heard from during the Third Reich.

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Ivan Ž.
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Re: Deutschlandlied (Deutschland, Deutschland über alles...)

Post by Ivan Ž. » 19 Oct 2019 09:53

Hello and :welcome:

Yes, it is a good recording, but please credit the source of the file.

Cheers,
Ivan

ManfredV
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Re: Deutschlandlied (Deutschland, Deutschland über alles...)

Post by ManfredV » 22 Oct 2019 17:09

First verse talks about borders of land that was german speaking and/or part of German Confederation at that time. Of course this is different today.
Deutschlandlied was written in a time when Germany was splitted into several monarchistic and not really democratic states. It was a yearning for a free democratic and united Germany. "Deutschland über alles" doesn't mean "Germany should rule the world " or "it is better than other countries".
It means "Germany should be first in my political yearning for unity, justice and liberty ". Its not chauvinistic or nationalistic but patriotic. So there is nothing wrong.
Deutschlandlied wasn't national anthem in Kaiserreich, they used "Heil dir im Siegerkranz".
Weimar Republic made Deutschlandlied national anthem. During Nazi time it was played/sung together with Horst-Wessel-Lied, which was de facto Nazi hymn.
After war new Federal Republic of Germany looked for a new hymn. Several other songs were discussed. Even president Heuss prefered another one. But at last they took Deutschlandlied, which stands for a free democratic and united Germany.
First verse is not forbidden but not used anymore, because it was discredited and could be misunderstood. Second verse sounds banal and ridiculous in modern view.
But third verse says whats important for Germany.
Compare Deutschlandlied with La Marseillaise and US national anthem: which ones are the bloodthirsty and martial ones? ;-)
Each anthem has it's historical context and has several interpretations during different eras. The way Nazis used Deutschlandlied is contrary to Hoffmann von Fallersleben's and german democratic movement's intention. But like many other german democrats and liberals Hoffmann later became more nationalistic and supported Bismarck.
By the way, Swiss national anthem "Schweizerpsalm" is a very good example of an hymn that shows pride and love for the home country without threating or martial behavior.

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