Reichsverband für Zucht und Prüfung deutschen Warmbluts

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afa485
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Reichsverband für Zucht und Prüfung deutschen Warmbluts

Post by afa485 » 15 Oct 2022 08:46

Dear Friends,

I am interested to find out information sources for the Reichsverband für Zucht und Prüfung deutschen Warmbluts. I have come across two types of membership badge for this organisation, one with an enamelled 'R' in the centre and another with the letter 'K'. Could anyone tell me what these letters mean please ?

Best Regards

Tony
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afa485
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Re: Reichsverband für Zucht und Prüfung deutschen Warmbluts

Post by afa485 » 15 Oct 2022 10:16

I am taking a wild guess here, but I would suggest from the research I have done that these two classes of association badge are for rider (Reiter) - hence the letter 'R' and for Cart Driver (Karren Fahrer) and hence the letter 'K'. If I am wrong I apologise, however if anyone can confirm this or tell me the correct meanings I would be very grateful.

Best Regards

Tony

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Hans1906
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Re: Reichsverband für Zucht und Prüfung deutschen Warmbluts

Post by Hans1906 » 15 Oct 2022 10:40

Hi Tony,

I could imagine that "R" stood for rider (Reiter) and "K" for coachman (Kutscher), that would be obvious...
(Without guarantee, both badges are unfortunately unknown to me personally...) :wink:

Fahrsport: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fahrsport

Die unrühmliche Nazi-Vergangenheit des Reitsports / The inglorious Nazi past of equestrianism https://www.welt.de/regionales/hamburg/ ... ports.html

(It's amazing, what can be found on the Internet, almost nothing was and is left out...) :?


Hans
„Im Leben gibt’s die Bösen und die Guten. Und die dazwischen, das sind die Bagaluten.“

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afa485
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Re: Reichsverband für Zucht und Prüfung deutschen Warmbluts

Post by afa485 » 15 Oct 2022 12:43

Hi Hans,

Good to hear from you ! I hope you are well. The 'Kutscher' information is very useful.

I like the badges of the equestrian Reichsverband and I have become interested in them because I was recently given one with the letter 'R' on it. Many of the Reichsverband qualification breast badges were worn on German military uniforms of course, having been introduced in April 1930. These enamel badges I guess were for civilian members, as pins were also available to military members who had the breast awards.

Many thanks for the online links.

Best Regards

Tony

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Re: Reichsverband für Zucht und Prüfung deutschen Warmbluts

Post by Hans1906 » 15 Oct 2022 13:10

Tony,

my pleasure, I would assume that these are older badges from the years before the National Socialists took power, i.e. before 1933 ?
The quality of craftsmanship is very good, the enamelling very nicely done, to a very high standard.

We will read it, what happens next, I'm curious..? :wink:

Equestrian athletes have always had money, people have never been stricken with poverty, this is reflected in these very finely made badges.

By the way, I don't remember either of the two badges on a German uniform after 1933, please correct me..?

And finally, the German term "Herrenreiter" has always applied to a(former?) German "Elite", not least also the members of the Reiter-SS, an ugly topic, in which not least the evil upstart named Hermann Fegelein is to be classified, etc.


Hans
„Im Leben gibt’s die Bösen und die Guten. Und die dazwischen, das sind die Bagaluten.“

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afa485
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Re: Reichsverband für Zucht und Prüfung deutschen Warmbluts

Post by afa485 » 15 Oct 2022 16:07

Hi Hans,

The riding badges worn on uniforms were like the one I have attached in the photo, and were awarded by the Reichsverband in Gold, Silver & Bronze. I have not seen the enamelled badges on a uniform, so I guess they were worn on civilian clothes by non-military members.

Best regards as ever,

Tony
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Re: Reichsverband für Zucht und Prüfung deutschen Warmbluts

Post by Hans1906 » 15 Oct 2022 17:04

Okay Tony,

"Leistungsabzeichen" (Pferdesport) https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leistungs ... erdesport)
(Was never produced with a swastika, right..?)

Unfortunately, this has nothing to do with the (your) badge above.

Our user "HPL2008" (?) will know the answer, not me, sorry, I throw in the towel. :?


Hans
„Im Leben gibt’s die Bösen und die Guten. Und die dazwischen, das sind die Bagaluten.“

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Re: Reichsverband für Zucht und Prüfung deutschen Warmbluts

Post by HPL2008 » 16 Oct 2022 11:15

The circular enamelled badges with the letter "R" are membership badges for the Reichsverband für Zucht und Prüfung deutschen Warmbluts. They also come as Ehrennadeln [honor pins] in silver or gold with an outer wreath of laurel leaves in, respectively, silver or gold. They were not authorized for wear with uniforms.

I don't have a definitive answer about the significance of the badges with the letter "K" and have not been able to find any solid information on them. I can offer a theory, though:

Personally, I don't think the "K" stands for "Kutscher". The "R-within-a-strap" was the Reichsverband's own logo; it doesn't make sense to me that coach drivers holding membership in the association should have been considered "unworthy" to wear it and get outwardly distinguished by wearing a "K" badge. I think the answer lies somewhere else...

Apart from the Reichsverband für Zucht und Prüfung deutschen Warmbluts [Reichs Association for the Breeding and Testing of German Warm-Blooded Horses], there was also a Reichsverband für Zucht und Prüfung deutschen Kaltbluts [Reichs Association for the Breeding and Testing of German Cold-Blooded Horses] (It is mentioned here: https://portal.ehri-project.eu/units/de-002429-r_68_i ). My theory is that the badges with the "K" are membership badges for that sister organisation.

(Incidentally, there also badges with an "S". It stands to reason that these are for yet another similiar organisation.)

About the equestrian badges:

The Deutsches Reiterabzeichen [German Horseman's Badge] and Deutsches Fahrerabzeichen [German (Horse) Driver's Badge] came in bronze, silver and gold. These were authorized for wear with uniforms.

Both awards were instituted in 1930 and never bore a swastika. Initially, they had the Reichsverband's "R" logo at the base. This type was awarded from 1930 to 1945 and even beyond that during the early post-war period. At some point during the early post-war period and after a name change of the organisation, the old "R" logo was dropped from the badge.

Of course, the markings on the reverse side also changed, from the pre-1945 ​​"REICHSVERBD. F. Z. U. PR. D. WARMBL." [= "Reichsverband für Zucht und Prüfung deutschen Warmbluts"] to the post-1945 "ZENTRALKOM. F. LEISTUNGSPR. W. U. KALTBL.-PF." [= "Zentral-Kommission für die Leistungsprüfungen von Warmblut- und Kaltblutpferden"].

Here are examples for the post-1945 badges in bronze and silver from my collection:

Reiterabz-Fahrerabz_br-si_a_Vs.jpg
Reiterabz-Fahrerabz_br-si_b_Rs.jpg
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Re: Reichsverband für Zucht und Prüfung deutschen Warmbluts

Post by afa485 » 17 Oct 2022 14:38

Many thanks Hans !

HPL2008, the fascinating information you give is very useful. Thank you. Your badges are an excellent postwar set.

Many people reading our thread may not be aware that the terms 'Warmblut' and 'Kaltblut' do not actually refer to the blood temperature of a horse. The term hot or cold-blooded is used to describe a horse’s temperament rather than its body temperature. The tasks that a horse performs can also be used to describe them, with hot-bloods being used for racing while cold-bloods are used for activities requiring a lot of strength.

I was very interested to know that a third organisation, using the letter 'S' on the badge may also exist. Perhaps a forum member has some knowledge of it and can help us with some further information.

So far I have only seen badges to this Reichsverband made by makers Steinhauer & Luck, Ludenscheid, but mostly by L.CHR.LAUER of Berlin & Nurnberg.

It would be interesting to know if other members have badges maker marked to other makers.

I really enjoy the design and quality of this Reichsverband badges, particularly the enamelled membership badges. For members interest, I have attached photos of the badge which inspired me to start this interesting thread.

Best regards as ever,

Tony
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HPL2008
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Re: Reichsverband für Zucht und Prüfung deutschen Warmbluts

Post by HPL2008 » 21 Oct 2022 18:41

afa485 wrote:
17 Oct 2022 14:38

So far I have only seen badges to this Reichsverband made by makers Steinhauer & Luck, Ludenscheid, but mostly by L.CHR.LAUER of Berlin & Nurnberg.

It would be interesting to know if other members have badges maker marked to other makers.
EMedals has an "R" and an "S" badge by Godet of Berlin on offer...:

https://www.emedals.com/german-horse-br ... dge-g11665
https://www.emedals.com/europe/germany/ ... rses-badge

...and there's a current eBay auction for a "K" badge with the maker's mark of Eduard Schultze (Inhaber Hermann Knöllner) of Potsdam:

https://www.ebay.de/itm/225205927753?ha ... R7S5kbn_YA

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afa485
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Re: Reichsverband für Zucht und Prüfung deutschen Warmbluts

Post by afa485 » 22 Oct 2022 12:41

I just found out through research that the Reichsverband fur Deutschen Warmbluts was founded in 1905 and the Reichsverband fur Deutschen Kaltbluts was founded in October 1921. This subject is very interesting to me and there are not very many sources of information about it online which cover the period of the Third Reich or earlier. If anyone has any information regarding the membership badges of these organisations I would be very interested to know.

Best Regards

Tony

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