1945 Lost German girl

Discussions on the role played by and situation of women in the Third Reich not covered in the other sections. Hosted by Vikki.
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ignacioosacar
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Re: 1945 Lost German girl

#1786

Post by ignacioosacar » 21 Aug 2015, 21:19

Danno,

Check page 104 and you may confirm location yourself

Cheers

FF7_12
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Re: 1945 Lost German girl

#1787

Post by FF7_12 » 22 Aug 2015, 11:59

Hi Fafha,

Thanks for that extra detail. I was quoting from Weidingers book only.

What I am not clear about is how Munchausen's story fits in to these events. If I understand him correctly LGG was seen together with a group of renegade Waffen SS soldiers somewhere on the road between Prague and Rok on 8th May.
It's probably difficult for Muchhausen's relative to reconstruct 70 years later, but I guess it's worth a try.


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Münchausen
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Re: 1945 Lost German girl

#1788

Post by Münchausen » 22 Aug 2015, 15:39

FF7_12 wrote:Hi Fafha,

Thanks for that extra detail. I was quoting from Weidingers book only.

What I am not clear about is how Munchausen's story fits in to these events. If I understand him correctly LGG was seen together with a group of renegade Waffen SS soldiers somewhere on the road between Prague and Rok on 8th May.
It's probably difficult for Muchhausen's relative to reconstruct 70 years later, but I guess it's worth a try.

My relative is absolutely sure that those men were "SS-Böhmen" because some of them told him they were.

FF7_12
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Re: 1945 Lost German girl

#1789

Post by FF7_12 » 22 Aug 2015, 17:05

Where did he meet them - was it between Prague and Rokycany ?

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Münchausen
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Re: 1945 Lost German girl

#1790

Post by Münchausen » 22 Aug 2015, 19:47

FF7_12 wrote:Where did he meet them - was it between Prague and Rokycany ?
Go to see him tonight. Shall come back later...

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Re: 1945 Lost German girl

#1791

Post by fhafha » 23 Aug 2015, 12:04

Münchausen wrote:
FF7_12 wrote:Hi Fafha,

Thanks for that extra detail. I was quoting from Weidingers book only.

What I am not clear about is how Munchausen's story fits in to these events. If I understand him correctly LGG was seen together with a group of renegade Waffen SS soldiers somewhere on the road between Prague and Rok on 8th May.
It's probably difficult for Muchhausen's relative to reconstruct 70 years later, but I guess it's worth a try.

My relative is absolutely sure that those men were "SS-Böhmen" because some of them told him they were.

Hi Munchausen. Thx for the details you and your relative provided. As a French and an officer, I am quite aware about the Alsacian Issue. It 's part of our Ethical education.

BTW, I would like to know what ur uncle means by SS Bohmen ? did they belong to the 31st SS DIV "Bohmen Mahren" or just they were Bohemia Natives ? Can be useful to determine their story.

Secondly, ur uncle said he drove from Prag to Rockycany area on the 8th (the day he met the LGG). Did he drove the main road or did he bypass main villages. These villages were hold by partisans and blockades were established (especially in Beroun and Herevice).

If he could remember any details of were he met the LGG group or when in the day, might be very important.

Thx for your help and welcome on board.

Regards.

FF7_12
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Re: 1945 Lost German girl

#1792

Post by FF7_12 » 23 Aug 2015, 12:18

Yes, and a beautiful and fascinating part of the world - Alsace. We're always pleased to make a visit across there from Germany - in particular my wife who is French.

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Münchausen
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Re: 1945 Lost German girl

#1793

Post by Münchausen » 23 Aug 2015, 17:39

fhafha wrote:
Münchausen wrote:
FF7_12 wrote:Hi Fafha,

Thanks for that extra detail. I was quoting from Weidingers book only.

What I am not clear about is how Munchausen's story fits in to these events. If I understand him correctly LGG was seen together with a group of renegade Waffen SS soldiers somewhere on the road between Prague and Rok on 8th May.
It's probably difficult for Muchhausen's relative to reconstruct 70 years later, but I guess it's worth a try.

My relative is absolutely sure that those men were "SS-Böhmen" because some of them told him they were.

Hi Munchausen. Thx for the details you and your relative provided. As a French and an officer, I am quite aware about the Alsacian Issue. It 's part of our Ethical education.

BTW, I would like to know what ur uncle means by SS Bohmen ? did they belong to the 31st SS DIV "Bohmen Mahren" or just they were Bohemia Natives ? Can be useful to determine their story.

Secondly, ur uncle said he drove from Prag to Rockycany area on the 8th (the day he met the LGG). Did he drove the main road or did he bypass main villages. These villages were hold by partisans and blockades were established (especially in Beroun and Herevice).

If he could remember any details of were he met the LGG group or when in the day, might be very important.

Thx for your help and welcome on board.

Regards.
Hi,

The motorcyclists - 5 motorcycles of Aufklärung-Abteilung - left South of Prague and then circulated on secondary roads by avoiding the urban areas because the attacks of the partisans but also the ROA were actually ceaseless. Next to the little city of Beraun (?) Sudeten Germans and where people gave to them something to eat and drink.

My great-uncle also remembers that one of his buddies was hurt in a place named Tesken (?) near a side street where there were dozens of "very damaged" corpses of Hungarian soldiers fallen in ambush. They occupied briefly a hill close to Oseck (?) rather high, which offered a good point of view on the sector of Rokycany and where " there were old ruins " then they finally decided to take the main road leading towards Pilsen.

It is there, before meeting American soldiers of the 16th Armoured Division that they noticed that small groups of German and Hungarian soldiers tried to join the demarcation line and walked in the same direction as them: all were surprised seeing them still well equipped and armed, possessing some gasoline and wrapped in white sheets!

The motorcyclists stopped twice: the first time to take care of their wounded companion who could not any more bear to stay on his motorcycle because his leg made him suffer.

The second time they were stopped by the LGG in the middle of the road. With her were, as I have already written, several "SS-Oberabschnitt Böhmen-Mähren" survivors of the "Kampfgruppe Wallenstein". « She was very attractive, very agitated, nervous and brave but terrified at the same time ". Several of the soldiers who wear civilian clothes had been also beaten, "certainly in Rokycany", but by civilians, not by partisans "otherwise they would have been killed ».

« Reaction of the Czech civilians was understandable: they had so suffered from the occupation of their country"... For my great-uncle, the place filmed by Haglund seems the same as the one where they stopped, but it happened 70 years ago and the lanscape is rather monotonous... The girl and her mates absolutely wanted to surrender – they said "surrender" - to the Americans, that is why may relative and his comrades advised them to wait for the passage of the column Weidinger. But, as the men were half-wearing civil clothes the risk existed for the « Das Reich » soldiers to refuse embedding them - SS-Böhmen were Allgemeine-SS and Waffen-SS - and specially enlisted Alsatians - didn't usually like Allgemeine very much....

I'd like giving you more ample details, but the encounter with the LGG lasted in most 10 minutes: it is easy to understand that the road was not secured yet by the US and that the motorcyclists were nervous and had orders which were of « not to stop before having established the planned-contact with the Americans ». On this point, the orders specified " to get in touch with the 16th Armoured Division at the exit of ROKYCANY and not " in ROKYCANY ", but in reality, it was necessary for them to go a little further before seeing Jeeps waiting on the roadside. You already know what happened after that.

You shall excuse my poor English!

B.R

Art.

fhafha
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Re: 1945 Lost German girl

#1794

Post by fhafha » 23 Aug 2015, 22:21

Again,

did ur uncle surender on the 8t or came back on the 9 th with the main column of the Das Reich ?

Was he part auf the aufklärung abtn of this division ? if so did he surrender with this unit. I am asking because there are footage of this unit surrender on the 9th near Rockyvany. The aufklärung abnt was of the DR was mixed with the 20th PZ Div aufklärung Abnt till the 5 or 6 of may 1945.

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... 8&t=142414

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Münchausen
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Re: 1945 Lost German girl

#1795

Post by Münchausen » 24 Aug 2015, 00:43

fhafha wrote:Again,

did ur uncle surender on the 8t or came back on the 9 th with the main column of the Das Reich ?

Was he part auf the aufklärung abtn of this division ? if so did he surrender with this unit. I am asking because there are footage of this unit surrender on the 9th near Rockyvany. The aufklärung abnt was of the DR was mixed with the 20th PZ Div aufklärung Abnt till the 5 or 6 of may 1945.

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... 8&t=142414
Very interesting link. Thank You.

He didn't really surrender the 8th even if the formalities of surrender began. He came back to the main column by the main road, this time, and surrender with it the 9th. The fact is that my relative always told us about the 8th, but then, I didn't took the time to have a discussion about this and so didn't knew the details of this very story. The LGG made me do that.

FF7_12
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Re: 1945 Lost German girl

#1796

Post by FF7_12 » 24 Aug 2015, 13:18

Was a he a member of the Kradmeldestaffel mentioned by Weidinger ?
Attachments
Weidinger_extract.JPG

ignacioosacar
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Re: 1945 Lost German girl

#1797

Post by ignacioosacar » 24 Aug 2015, 21:50

Dear Forum and Muchausen,

The story is fascinating. It all makes sense to me. Most small actions taken by the motocycle patrol were what it should be done tactically, like getting to the top of a hill to see if there was enemy activity on the road ahead, avoiding villages, not stopping until contact was made etc. It is understandable to have certain inaccurancies after so many years. In my experience recalling dramatic events that happened many years ago, is like watching short separate captions of a video, sometines you are not even capable to link one to the other, and sometimes whole segments in between are just deleted.

So, it is possible that the group sitting with LGG are Allgemeine SS if I clearly understood ?

Cheers

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Dr Eisvogel
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Re: 1945 Lost German girl

#1798

Post by Dr Eisvogel » 25 Aug 2015, 18:38

Münchausen wrote:
Hi,

The motorcyclists - 5 motorcycles of Aufklärung-Abteilung - left South of Prague and then circulated on secondary roads by avoiding the urban areas because the attacks of the partisans but also the ROA were actually ceaseless. Next to the little city of Beraun (?) Sudeten Germans and where people gave to them something to eat and drink.

My great-uncle also remembers that one of his buddies was hurt in a place named Tesken (?) near a side street where there were dozens of "very damaged" corpses of Hungarian soldiers fallen in ambush. They occupied briefly a hill close to Oseck (?) rather high, which offered a good point of view on the sector of Rokycany and where " there were old ruins " then they finally decided to take the main road leading towards Pilsen.


B.R

Art.
city of Beraun => in Czech language: Beroun

place named Tesken (?) => ???

a hill close to Oseck (?) = in Czech language: Osek (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osek_(Rokycany_District))

***

Could Tesken be Těškov? (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T%C4%9B%C5%A1kov)

***

Prague-Beroun = 38 km

Prague-Těškov = 68.6 km

Prague-Osek = 86.4 km

***

Best regards,
Eisvogel

ignacioosacar
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Re: 1945 Lost German girl

#1799

Post by ignacioosacar » 26 Aug 2015, 21:25

Dear Forum and Munchausen

1.Regarding your great uncle meeting and conversation with LGG.

1.1 Did she came to him alone or together with other persons ?

1.2 Did the other persons talked to him also ?

1.3 Were they the group sitting around her in the ditch ?

2. Regarding the circumstances of your great uncle first contact with the LGG film

2.1 How did your great uncle react when he saw the LGG film ?

2.2 Could you tell us again how your great uncle saw the LGG film for the first time ? Was he surfing the web ? Were you surfing the web and him sitting beside you ? Was it on TV ?

2.3 How did your grat uncle react when he learned about this thread ?

Cheers

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Münchausen
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Re: 1945 Lost German girl

#1800

Post by Münchausen » 27 Aug 2015, 23:29

FF7_12 wrote:Was a he a member of the Kradmeldestaffel mentioned by Weidinger ?
He was not, but he knew very well a man named Wulf who was.

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