SS-Division "Handschar" photos
- FlyingStukas
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Re: SS-Division "Handschar" photos
Ivan has warned you multiple times but I don't think you quite realize what the problem is - inquiring is fine. Researching, trying to make valid connections, even assumptions, is fine. Using uncredited sources and "drawing" over historical photos to make some unconfirmed connections is not fine! I don't want to demonstrate here how easily I can manipulate/photoshop photos, and quite literally like Ivan said, could place my grandmother to appear "realistic" in this time period. Once again - reliable sources, - no drawing over photos, - keep a dose of skepticism for everything you come across, especially with the Handschar Division.
Cheers,
Filip
Cheers,
Filip
- FlyingStukas
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Re: SS-Division "Handschar" photos
Seems like the "Imam discussion" has come to a standstill, so let's change the topic a little bit.
Here's an interesting photo from Beeldbank WO2, depicting one of the iconic 5 artillery brothers of the division, Jašar.
The original file name says "Five brothers and one Howitzer. As he learned over a period of time in Germany, Jašar prepares the "Doppelzünder" (Flak Shell). The file is pretty straight-forward, and even has a nice date and location.
My question - is there any indication of might have happened with these boys after the war? Any indication on any of them being KIA?
Cheers,
Filip
Here's an interesting photo from Beeldbank WO2, depicting one of the iconic 5 artillery brothers of the division, Jašar.
The original file name says "Five brothers and one Howitzer. As he learned over a period of time in Germany, Jašar prepares the "Doppelzünder" (Flak Shell). The file is pretty straight-forward, and even has a nice date and location.
My question - is there any indication of might have happened with these boys after the war? Any indication on any of them being KIA?
Cheers,
Filip
- Attachments
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- Source: Beeldbank WO2, File Number: 3592
- April 1944, Jasar (one of the 5 brothers) from the Handschar Division, Bosnia.jpg (51.95 KiB) Viewed 3123 times
Re: SS-Division "Handschar" photos
Ok Filip,look at this picture -Mufti and Salih Hadzialich(with glasses by the mufti in the coat) visitng the troops,Neuhammer late 1943
Regarding your brothers and howitzer question,maybe they died,they were really young and probably not that skillful in the war.
Regarding your brothers and howitzer question,maybe they died,they were really young and probably not that skillful in the war.
- Attachments
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- SOURCE-GETTY
- 1554374458782.image (1).png (155.4 KiB) Viewed 3123 times
Best Regards
-Huska
-Huska
- FlyingStukas
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Re: SS-Division "Handschar" photos
Hello, Huska
War isn't as straight-forward as dying due to "being young not that skillful". Maybe someone else knows of their fate?
Cheers,
Filip
War isn't as straight-forward as dying due to "being young not that skillful". Maybe someone else knows of their fate?
Cheers,
Filip
- balkanguy44
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Re: SS-Division "Handschar" photos
Hello, Filip
From what I know at least one of them was KIA but I don’t know it exactly.
Cheers,
BG44
From what I know at least one of them was KIA but I don’t know it exactly.
Cheers,
BG44
Cheers,
BG44
BG44
- DFrolov1992
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- Location: Russia
Re: SS-Division "Handschar" photos
Hello FilipFlyingStukas wrote: ↑04 Apr 2019, 14:09Seems like the "Imam discussion" has come to a standstill, so let's change the topic a little bit.
Here's an interesting photo from Beeldbank WO2, depicting one of the iconic 5 artillery brothers of the division, Jašar.
The original file name says "Five brothers and one Howitzer. As he learned over a period of time in Germany, Jašar prepares the "Doppelzünder" (Flak Shell). The file is pretty straight-forward, and even has a nice date and location.
My question - is there any indication of might have happened with these boys after the war? Any indication on any of them being KIA?
Cheers,
Filip
In fact, the brothers were not five, but six. This becomes known from the speech of the Great Mufti of Jerusalem published in the divisional newspaper "Handschar" (Folge 8 Seite 3)
It is practically impossible to find out the post-war fate of Muslim volunteers, unless they had data (rare exceptions) in the DRK database (Deutsches Rotes Kreuz) and if they did not come into the view of the state security agencies.
Regards
Re: SS-Division "Handschar" photos
Hello, FilipFlyingStukas wrote: ↑04 Apr 2019, 14:09The file is pretty straight-forward, and even has a nice date and location.
Ignore archival dates and locations, they are too often incorrect. As far as I know, there's no date/location written for these photos originally.
Hello, DmitryDFrolov1992 wrote: ↑05 Apr 2019, 11:12In fact, the brothers were not five, but six. This becomes known from the speech of the Great Mufti of Jerusalem published in the divisional newspaper "Handschar" (Folge 8 Seite 3)
See page 21 viewtopic.php?f=51&t=77027&p=2177240#p2177240 (and you've also been given credit for discovering this nice little detail )
Cheers,
Ivan
- DFrolov1992
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Re: SS-Division "Handschar" photos
Hello, IvanIvan Ž. wrote: ↑05 Apr 2019, 11:57Hello, FilipFlyingStukas wrote: ↑04 Apr 2019, 14:09The file is pretty straight-forward, and even has a nice date and location.
Ignore archival dates and locations, they are too often incorrect. As far as I know, there's no date/location written for these photos originally.
Hello, DmitryDFrolov1992 wrote: ↑05 Apr 2019, 11:12In fact, the brothers were not five, but six. This becomes known from the speech of the Great Mufti of Jerusalem published in the divisional newspaper "Handschar" (Folge 8 Seite 3)
See page 21 viewtopic.php?f=51&t=77027&p=2177240#p2177240 (and you've also been given credit for discovering this nice little detail )
Cheers,
Ivan
Thank you, I forgot about what you already wrote about it.
Regards
Re: SS-Division "Handschar" photos
High quality picture of Handschar Soldaten
1944
1944
Best Regards
-Huska
-Huska
- balkanguy44
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Re: SS-Division "Handschar" photos
According to a French page this is SS-Standartenführer Oskar Kirchbaum but the rank of this person is SS-Obersturmbannführer. Can somebody confirm the identity of this officer?
(Source: http://historeich.blogspot.com/2017/05/ ... nerie.html)
(Source: http://historeich.blogspot.com/2017/05/ ... nerie.html)
Cheers,
BG44
BG44
Re: SS-Division "Handschar" photos
It's indeed Kirchbaum, who was an SS-Obersturmbannführer (not SS-Standartenführer, that's an error).
The photo source is "Himmler's Bosnian Division" by G. Lepre (someone tried to restore it a bit, and failed).
Cheers,
Ivan
The photo source is "Himmler's Bosnian Division" by G. Lepre (someone tried to restore it a bit, and failed).
Cheers,
Ivan
- balkanguy44
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- balkanguy44
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- Posts: 309
- Joined: 11 Apr 2018, 18:51
- Location: Austria
Re: SS-Division "Handschar" photos
Heinrich Himmler talks with a young German instructor, Neuhammer, November 1943.
Who is the guy next to Himmler (left side)?
(Source: Wiener Illustrierte, issue from 12 January 1944)
Who is the guy next to Himmler (left side)?
(Source: Wiener Illustrierte, issue from 12 January 1944)
Last edited by balkanguy44 on 07 May 2019, 20:36, edited 1 time in total.
Cheers,
BG44
BG44
Re: SS-Division "Handschar" photos
The source says nothing about a place nor a date when this visit happened. And the photo caption isbalkanguy44 wrote: ↑07 May 2019, 19:00Heinrich Himmler talks with a young German instructor, Neuhammer, January 1944.
[...]
(Source: Wiener Illustrierte, issue from 12 January 1944)
" In conversation with a German instructor from the young Bosnian Volunteer- SS".
http://anno.onb.ac.at/cgi-content/anno? ... =3&zoom=37
- balkanguy44
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Re: SS-Division "Handschar" photos
Hello, history1
It was taken at the Neuhammer Training Grounds in November 1943. As you can see there (just take a look at the caption of the first picture).
I didn’t transelate the caption into English 1:1 because it wasn’t my intention at all. Your translation sounds a bit like classic “Germanismus“.
Cheers,
BG44
It was taken at the Neuhammer Training Grounds in November 1943. As you can see there (just take a look at the caption of the first picture).
I didn’t transelate the caption into English 1:1 because it wasn’t my intention at all. Your translation sounds a bit like classic “Germanismus“.
Cheers,
BG44
Last edited by balkanguy44 on 07 May 2019, 20:36, edited 1 time in total.
Cheers,
BG44
BG44