BATTLEAXE Flak 88s

[ClintHardware]

Hi All

I have gone through German and British accounts and war diaries to establish where Flak 88s were and then where the British tanks were in terms of time of day, place and grid reference etc to produce a number of Probably Knocked Out by Flak 88s. This figure is 38.

There is also a figure of British tanks knocked out where Flak 88s may have been the primary or the secondary cause. The lack and clarity of data available has produced a shared figure of 22.

These figures are higher than I had expected, and the combined total is 60 which seems reasonable under battlefield conditions. My written account of the operation includes all the claims made by both sides.

Has anyone got a copy of the original German text of Oberleutnant Kümmel's account that they could let me have/purchase.

[ClintHardware]

4th Indian Division's Intelligence Summary No.158, based on information up to 1st July 1941, includes two drawings of a disassembled 88 mm round which is APBCHET not APCBCHET. This evidence may partly contribute to explaning the above lower numbers.

[Dili]

What is the difference ?

[Alanmccoubrey]

What do they mean ?

[Dili]

I meant why the round type would explain the lower numbers.

[ClintHardware]

Alan: Armour Piercing Capped Ballistic Capped High Explosive Tracer. However APBCHET only has the Ballistic Cap

Dili: Without the Cap on the AP projectile the chances are greater of ricochet and shatter at steeper angles of impact and the cap also enables the projectile to turn to reduce the impact angle (before penetration begins) to be closer to 0 degrees. It is unlikely that any 88 AP projectile had shatter induced because of the range and remaining velocity at impact.

Major-General Messervy in his post battle reports recorded that 13 tanks had to be abandoned in Capuzzo by 7th RTR on the 17th despite only needing some time for fitters to effect repairs. These 13 appear to have not have been penetrated by 88s but perhaps clipped by them. Capuzzo was shelled, bombed, attcked by Pzr Rgt 8 several times and other anti-tank fire from 20mm, 37mm and two Pak 38s (2 taken by the 1st Buffs and at least one re-employed by them), and 88s. So anything might have caused the damage to the 13 and more than once, including mechanical break down. 16 7th RTR tanks withdrew on the 17th.

[critical mass]

There was, to the best of my knowledge no uncapped AP round issued to service 88mm.
Not sure about HE, though.

[ClintHardware]

There was, to the best of my knowledge no uncapped AP round issued to service 88mm.
Not sure about HE, though.

To the best of Jentz's knowledge I thought the same as you.