Police Insignia Identification/Authenticity

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ww2collector1944
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Police Insignia Identification/Authenticity

#1

Post by ww2collector1944 » 02 Sep 2020, 04:05

Good afternoon,

I recently received this insignia as a gift and wanted to determine if it was authentic and also what type of insignia this is. It looks like a police cartouche for a dress ammunition pouch, although the pins are confusing me.

Any feedback is appreciated, I was thinking this could be related to the police or even water police. Thank you and have a great night.
118425755_642039196451974_5358317694239839422_n.jpg
118354348_3247516478702168_9191186384165805913_n.jpg

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von thoma
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Re: Police Insignia Identification/Authenticity

#2

Post by von thoma » 02 Sep 2020, 22:12

Sorry, but looking at some details, it looks like a copy of a Police Eagle pattern .....
" The right to believe is the right of those who don't know "


ww2collector1944
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Re: Police Insignia Identification/Authenticity

#3

Post by ww2collector1944 » 04 Sep 2020, 03:11

thanks for the information! I appreciate it. Have a great day

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Hans1906
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Re: Police Insignia Identification/Authenticity

#4

Post by Hans1906 » 04 Sep 2020, 10:18

Good morning ww2collector1944,

if you google the terms "Polizei" and "Kartuschkasten", some photos show up,
and you will find some of the photos quite interesting...

You will also find interesting photos of the back of the eagle, which raise further questions about your piece..? :?

The originality of the eagle on the basis of your photos, I personally do not think it is possible, a comparable piece is not available here.
Reproductions or forgeries are widely known, sometimes in first-class quality.

Good luck for your further researches!

Hans1906

P.S. The Angolia book "German Police" might be very helpful, to sorry, not in my library.
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Angolia German Police.jpg
Angolia German Police.jpg (98.05 KiB) Viewed 5768 times
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von thoma
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Re: Police Insignia Identification/Authenticity

#5

Post by von thoma » 04 Sep 2020, 20:27

The Angolia book "German Police" might be very helpful, to sorry, not in my library.
Yes, I have both volumes...highly recommended.
The originality of the eagle on the basis of your photos, I personally do not think it is possible, a comparable piece is not available here.
A fine police "Kartuschkasten" eagle pattern example ;
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206 Cartouche Eagle GHD.jpg
" The right to believe is the right of those who don't know "

ww2collector1944
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Re: Police Insignia Identification/Authenticity

#6

Post by ww2collector1944 » 09 Sep 2020, 05:48

thank you all very much for your help. I greatly appreciate the insight. Moving forward I will be sure to purchase from an online dealer verses an antique store. This was actually a gift and still is a nice display nonetheless.

Thank you all again and have a great day.

Best,

JoeW
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Re: Police Insignia Identification/Authenticity

#7

Post by JoeW » 09 Sep 2020, 06:45

von thoma wrote:
04 Sep 2020, 20:27
The Angolia book "German Police" might be very helpful, to sorry, not in my library.
Yes, I have both volumes...highly recommended.
The originality of the eagle on the basis of your photos, I personally do not think it is possible, a comparable piece is not available here.
A fine police "Kartuschkasten" eagle pattern example ;
The eagle pattern you pictured above was used on both the decorative parade dress Kartouche Kasten and the Schutzhelm used by motorcycle riders and armored vehicle crew. Both aluminum/silver color and gold finish eagles are found and were used on both the Kasten and the helmets. All eagle provided for the Kasten were secured with three small D rings on the reverse of the eagle through which a leather piece was threaded. The eagles for the Sturz Helm (crash helmet) were made with three split brads on the reverse which enabled the eagle to be secured through the thick liner of the helmets.

The first volume of the Taylor-Angolia book suffers from poor organization and some inclusion of reproduction material and mis-information. But it is the only reference available in English. Deuster's book is in German only.

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Hans1906
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Re: Police Insignia Identification/Authenticity

#8

Post by Hans1906 » 10 Sep 2020, 18:40

JoeW,

"The first volume of the Taylor-Angolia book suffers from poor organization and some inclusion of reproduction material and mis-information. But it is the only reference available in English."

Since this two-volume work still seems to be a "reference", is there a way to correct the errors it contains?

A concise example would be very interesting, which hopefully is possible?

Hans1906
The paradise of the successful lends itself perfectly to a hell for the unsuccessful. (Bertold Brecht on Hollywood)

JoeW
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Re: Police Insignia Identification/Authenticity

#9

Post by JoeW » 11 Sep 2020, 00:46

A number of items of my collection were included in the first volume. Reproductions and mis-information was particularly noticeable in the section on Mountain/Ski badges/awards. My volume is marked up with those errors I found, but to read the entire book is a monumental challenge. Are you wanting specific examples of errors as evidence of my statement?

We (other collectors and I) discussed with Hugh Page-Taylor offering an errata page, but the work never progressed. I still have a file folder with notes. Taylor did most of the work on the volume, of course with the assistance of the late Roger Bender. The second volume has some police but is mostly a volume on the TENO.

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William Kramer
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Re: Police Insignia Identification/Authenticity

#10

Post by William Kramer » 07 Oct 2020, 17:08

I would agree that the first eagle posted at the top of the thread is a reproduction.

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