WWII Conspricy Theories

Discussions on alternate history, including events up to 20 years before today. Hosted by Terry Duncan.
Post Reply
Avalancheon
Member
Posts: 373
Joined: 23 Apr 2017, 07:01
Location: Canada

Re: WWII Conspricy Theories

#91

Post by Avalancheon » 30 Sep 2020, 09:27

Sid Guttridge wrote:
29 Sep 2020, 06:56
Hi Avalancheon,

The opposite of an "unproven conspiracy theory" is not a proven conspiracy theory. The opposite of an unproven conspiracy theory is a hard historical fact.

Indeed, the word "unproven" is entirely redundant. "Conspiracy theories" are by definition "unproven" because they lack the necessary hard historical evidence.

All your supposedly "proven conspiracy theories" were never conspiracy theories in the first place. They may have been conspiracies, but they were things that actually happened for which there is ample historical evidence. There is nothing theoretical about them.
The essence of the matter is this. Whenever an event happens, people will try to explain how it happened. In certain cases, they will make a theory that it was the result of a conspiracy. Thus we have the conjunction of two words, 'conspiracy theory.'

Some will back up their theory with hard evidence, while others will not. The strength or weakness of the theory does not change its conspiratorial element, despite what you claim. Even when conspiracy theorys are accepted by historians as a self-evident fact, that doesn't change the conspiratorial nature of the theory.
Sid Guttridge wrote:
29 Sep 2020, 06:56
You are pretending that "unproven conspiracy theories" are in History's "pending tray". They are not. They are in history's trash bin.

Cheers,

Sid.
You might think that, but you would be wrong. After WW2, people made up all kinds of conspiracy theorys about the German enigma codes being broken by the Allies. The existence of the ULTRA program wasn't declassified until the 1970s. Only then was the conspiracy theory accepted as a fact by historians. This process goes on all the time. People made conspiracy theorys that the Soviets were responsible for the Katyn massacre, but this wasn't declassified until decades later!

Sid Guttridge
Member
Posts: 10158
Joined: 12 Jun 2008, 12:19

Re: WWII Conspricy Theories

#92

Post by Sid Guttridge » 30 Sep 2020, 11:04

Hi Avalancheon,

You say, "After WW2, people made up all kinds of conspiracy theorys about the German enigma codes being broken by the Allies."

1) Did they? What is the evidence?

2) There appears to be no conspiracy here in the first place. Just a well kept secret.

Cheers,

Sid.


OpanaPointer
Financial supporter
Posts: 5637
Joined: 16 May 2010, 15:12
Location: United States of America

Re: WWII Conspricy Theories

#93

Post by OpanaPointer » 30 Sep 2020, 13:34

Come visit our sites:
hyperwarHyperwar
World War II Resources

Bellum se ipsum alet, mostly Doritos.

Rob Stuart
Member
Posts: 1200
Joined: 18 Apr 2009, 01:41
Location: Ottawa

Re: WWII Conspricy Theories

#94

Post by Rob Stuart » 30 Sep 2020, 17:36

After WW2, people made up all kinds of conspiracy theorys about the German enigma codes being broken by the Allies. The existence of the ULTRA program wasn't declassified until the 1970s. Only then was the conspiracy theory accepted as a fact by historians.
This wasn't a conspiracy theory. It was just an ordinary theory.

Carl Schwamberger
Host - Allied sections
Posts: 10048
Joined: 02 Sep 2006, 21:31
Location: USA

Re: WWII Conspricy Theories

#95

Post by Carl Schwamberger » 30 Sep 2020, 18:47

There was the idea the Isei and nisei Japanse immigrants and descendants were involved in a large scale spy and sabotage network, a potential Fifth Column. This was used to justify the relocation of this population in 1942.

I'm curious about the reaction & fallout were proof discovered post war that there was infact a large agent network ready to act?

User avatar
EKB
Member
Posts: 712
Joined: 20 Jul 2005, 18:21
Location: United States

Re: WWII Conspiracy Theories

#96

Post by EKB » 24 Oct 2020, 03:50

As long as people keep buying the legend of Operation Long Jump, the publishers will keep selling new versions.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Night-Assassin ... op?ie=UTF8
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Operation-Long ... 757&sr=8-1

User avatar
T. A. Gardner
Member
Posts: 3541
Joined: 02 Feb 2006, 01:23
Location: Arizona

Re: WWII Conspricy Theories

#97

Post by T. A. Gardner » 24 Oct 2020, 04:51

There's the Ju 390 that flew within a few miles of New York story...

Carl Schwamberger
Host - Allied sections
Posts: 10048
Joined: 02 Sep 2006, 21:31
Location: USA

Re: WWII Conspricy Theories

#98

Post by Carl Schwamberger » 24 Oct 2020, 17:20

T. A. Gardner wrote:
24 Oct 2020, 04:51
There's the Ju 390 that flew within a few miles of New York story...
I'd give that one more credit if the Italians were the accused. That aside the effect of proof would be a massive surge on other 'The Germans Did That' stories.

historygeek2021
Member
Posts: 641
Joined: 17 Dec 2020, 07:23
Location: Australia

Re: WWII Conspricy Theories

#99

Post by historygeek2021 » 26 Mar 2021, 06:07

Britain and France deliberately lost in 1940, so that Germany and Russia would destroy each other.

Stalin ordered unending suicidal attacks throughout the war because he wanted to depopulate the country.

Post Reply

Return to “What if”