How were Luftwaffe personnel integrated into the Waffen-SS?

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derstedinger
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How were Luftwaffe personnel integrated into the Waffen-SS?

#1

Post by derstedinger » 28 Dec 2020, 12:57

According to "Men of Steel" by Michael Reynolds the 1st SS Panzer incorporated a significant number of Luftwaffe personnel in their ranks before Operation Wacht am Rhein in order to replenish manpower shortages. How were these Luftwaffe personnel (whom i assume formerly served in support/clerical duties as airfield crews) integrated into a Panzer and Grenadier unit such as the 1st SS Panzer? Did they go through Infantry/Tank/Artllery etc. school prior to being placed in the 1st SS? Also did the Luftwaffe personnel have their ranks "converted" to Waffen-SS ranks? For example; did Luftwaffe Unteroffiziers join the 1st SS as Unterscharfuehrers?

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Re: How were Luftwaffe personnel integrated into the Waffen-SS?

#2

Post by aquarya » 28 Dec 2020, 15:30

I had a 5th Wiking battalion commander tell me that these Luftwaffe soldiers (as well as a ceremonial naval unit) just arrived and were put into Stellung....it was a complete disaster. During the first Russian tank attack, they ran panicked and screaming back past his command post. He grabbed one and asked why they were running. The man in question said it was a tank attack. The battalion commander asked, "Infantry too?" The answer was no. The battalion commander rounded these newcomers up and wearily sent them back to their foxholes, saying, "they're just tanks." Like, no big deal.


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Re: How were Luftwaffe personnel integrated into the Waffen-SS?

#3

Post by mihaiS » 28 Dec 2020, 19:57

In Rolf Michaelis's "Die 10. SS-Panzer-Division "Frundsberg"" there is a passage that quotes the commander of SS-Feld-Ersatz-Bataillon 10. I've uploaded it here. My German is quite limited, but from what I understand, he says that he received ~1.500 Luftwaffe personnel (from Hauptfeldwebels to Gefreiters), ~500 were sent to the division's Werkstatt-Kompanien, ~200 became radio operators, ~180 became Unterführer instructors (??), while the rest went to the Feld-Ersatz-Bataillon for training. Then he proceeds to explain said training: shooting the MG from the hip while walking and running, throwing grenades, shooting wagons on a field railway (in lieu of tanks) with Panzerfäuste. Unfortunately, I don't know how reliable this author is, as I have only stumbled upon his book while researching Frundsberg's refitting at Arnhem.

AliasDavid
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Re: How were Luftwaffe personnel integrated into the Waffen-SS?

#4

Post by AliasDavid » 31 Dec 2020, 15:54

Hello,
mihaiS wrote:
28 Dec 2020, 19:57
... ~180 became Unterführer instructors (??)...
~180, who had acted as instructors, were registered for NCO training (my translation)
.

It appears that those who had useful competencies were employed accordingly (technical personel, NCOs) . Those who hadn't (clerks?) were trained as infanterymen. Note that the batch of 1500 men apparently didn't include officers.

UlrichH

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Harro
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Re: How were Luftwaffe personnel integrated into the Waffen-SS?

#5

Post by Harro » 02 Jan 2021, 11:59

This started in April 1943 with a first batch of 2,500 Luftwaffe ground crew for the Leibstandarte and continued through the rest of the war. In December 1944 the SS-PzAA1 was 25-30% Luftwaffe and Kriegsmarine. Ground crew and dockers but also NCO's and officer candidates. Most were given the usual six weeks of basic training followed by additional training with their new outfit but this all depended on time and means.

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Re: How were Luftwaffe personnel integrated into the Waffen-SS?

#6

Post by Harro » 02 Jan 2021, 12:03

"The men were young, all inexperienced, almost all of them former Luftwaffe ground personnel. We were fully equipped with machine guns, machine pistols, etc. Fire practise was the only training that had been completed. The most decisive shortcoming was the lack of any driver training due to the general fuel shortage. The march to the loading railroad station was the first time the company drove together as a unit!"

- Hans-Martin Leidreiter, CO 3./SS-PzAA1 LSSAH, about his company on the eve of the Battle of the Bulge. Helmut, also 3./SS-PzAA1 until his transfer to the Stabskompanie, added that due to shortages most of these men were not even issued Waffen-SS gear and fought in the Ardennes in their old Luftwaffe uniforms, helmets and greatcoats.

Walter, in December 1944 an SPW-driver in 2./SS-PzAA1 LSSAH, remembered a Junker in a Waffen-SS uniform but with Luftwaffe epaulettes with ‘LKS 6’ embroidered on them – which stood for ‘Luftkriegsschule 6’. Walter was himself one of the original 2,500 from April 1943.

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Re: How were Luftwaffe personnel integrated into the Waffen-SS?

#7

Post by mihaiS » 11 Jan 2023, 11:47

Harro wrote:
02 Jan 2021, 11:59
This started in April 1943 with a first batch of 2,500 Luftwaffe ground crew for the Leibstandarte and continued through the rest of the war. In December 1944 the SS-PzAA1 was 25-30% Luftwaffe and Kriegsmarine. Ground crew and dockers but also NCO's and officer candidates. Most were given the usual six weeks of basic training followed by additional training with their new outfit but this all depended on time and means.
I have recently come across a document of II. SS-Panzerkorps that reminded me of this thread. It would seem that the actual number was quite larger.

Image

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Harro
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Re: How were Luftwaffe personnel integrated into the Waffen-SS?

#8

Post by Harro » 12 Jan 2023, 22:08

Very interesting, thank you for posting that!

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Re: How were Luftwaffe personnel integrated into the Waffen-SS?

#9

Post by fox3-6 » 14 Jan 2023, 17:44

Page 194-197 in The Leibstandarte Vol. III covers an instance of Luftwaffe personnel integrating into Leibstandarte when the division received a large influx of personnel after Kharkov and before Kursk in 1943.

The division commander and the Ia fly to Goerings headquarters to discuss the matter.. After negotiations a group of 2500 personnel, roughly 25% feldwebels, 50% NCOs, and 25% service grade enlisted men from the Luftwaffe are to be transferred. They arrive at Leibstandarte in May of 1943. They are overwhelmingly portepeeuntoffiziere, thus of feldwebel rank.

"The first transport train contained about 500 men, whom the divisional commander welcomed with an address. The obergruppenfuhrer undertook the task right then of calling for volunteers for the panzergrenadiere. The small show of hands was no bigger when he asked for volunteers for the Aufklarungsabteilung. The artillery and other heavy weapons, as well as the panzerregiment found a little more favor. The repair section and the division supply troops were the favorite choices. The obergruppenfuhrer skipped the reception for later trainloads."

They received a few days worth of combat training on the grounds at Lichterfelde barracks they had been carted off to join the division in the field.

"truly this was unworthy treatment. When one knows that, one can only be amazed at and respectful of the exemplary manner in which these men performed their service. In retrospect, one can notice how these soldiers joined the individual units willingly and without complaint. In a short time they were impossible to tell apart from the other members of the LAH."

"During the ensuing rest period, the units undertook a training program ordered by the division; it lasted 5 weeks until 7.6.1943. Another five-week training program was added to the end of it... but the commencement of the march for "Zitadelle" brought it to an end on 28.6."

In other words, in this specific case they were trained briefly at Lichterfelde barracks. Transported to Leibstandarte, assigned to units, and put through a training program for several months. It probably varies on a case by base basis.. depending on what the needs of the units are.

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