8,8 cm PzGr 39 Performance

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Peasant
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Re: 8,8 cm PzGr 39 Performance

Post by Peasant » 13 Aug 2021 23:16

Mobius wrote:
13 Aug 2021 21:33
Yes, but because they have different muzzle velocities their starting Ballistic Coefficient would be slightly different.
That's news for me. I thought both weapons had muzzle velocity of 835m/s with 5cm PzGr.39, but you're saying they were different?

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Contender
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Re: 8,8 cm PzGr 39 Performance

Post by Contender » 14 Aug 2021 01:53

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Ian v hogg GAWW2 wrote: 840 m/s (probably for HE).....5 cm Pzgr Patr 42: fuzed BD Z 5103, Projectile weight 2.34 kg (4.92lb), complete round weight 4.35kg (9.59lb). An armour-piercing shell of conventional design, this was made of chromium steel. The driving band was of soft Iron and the bursting charge was PETN/wax. A tracer, burning for 2sec, was also fitted. This round was issued as an anti-tank round for ground use, and was in fact the normal 5cm PAK projectile fitted to the flak case.
Last edited by Contender on 14 Aug 2021 03:05, edited 1 time in total.

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Mobius
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Re: 8,8 cm PzGr 39 Performance

Post by Mobius » 14 Aug 2021 02:33

Peasant wrote:
13 Aug 2021 23:16
Mobius wrote:
13 Aug 2021 21:33
Yes, but because they have different muzzle velocities their starting Ballistic Coefficient would be slightly different.
That's news for me. I thought both weapons had muzzle velocity of 835m/s with 5cm PzGr.39, but you're saying they were different?
You might have been confused 5.0cm KwK 38 L/42 is the early tank gun 685m/s. The PaK 38 is the anti-tank gun L/60 835 m/s.

critical mass
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Re: 8,8 cm PzGr 39 Performance

Post by critical mass » 25 Aug 2021 12:57

I have no information in regard to the KwK39, Flak 41 is positive, though.

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Mobius
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Re: 8,8 cm PzGr 39 Performance

Post by Mobius » 27 Aug 2021 02:31

critical mass wrote:
25 Aug 2021 12:57
I have no information in regard to the KwK39, Flak 41 is positive, though.
You should have it. One 5cm KwK39 firing table can be found here.
http://www.lexpev.nl/manuals/germanyold.html
German WW2 aircraft ammo: Handbuch Für Flugzeug Bordmunition 1936-1945 [7482 KB] pg 62

ThatZenoGuy
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Re: 8,8 cm PzGr 39 Performance

Post by ThatZenoGuy » 27 Aug 2021 06:59

So the KwK39 could fire PzGr42?

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Contender
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Re: 8,8 cm PzGr 39 Performance

Post by Contender » 27 Aug 2021 10:52

I suspect barring some workaround or complete abandonment or modification of the original Pzgr 39 round the optic would require a new "Pzgr 42" scale for accuracy due to the more aerodynamic shape. Anyone that has the Panzer III J1-M's T.z.f.5E or documentation relating to it can tell you one way or the other if there is a "Pzgr 42" scale unfortunately I have nothing on this other than the "simplification" (basic details are wrong- :lol: ) printed in the osprey books. The more recent Sdfkz-234/2 on the other hand used a T.z.f.4B optic as far as I know there is no description of this optic and I have never seen documentation or real life examples either.

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Mobius
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Re: 8,8 cm PzGr 39 Performance

Post by Mobius » 27 Aug 2021 12:22

Contender wrote:
27 Aug 2021 10:52
I suspect barring some workaround or complete abandonment or modification of the original Pzgr 39 round the optic would require a new "Pzgr 42" scale for accuracy due to the more aerodynamic shape. Anyone that has the Panzer III J1-M's T.z.f.5E or documentation relating to it can tell you one way or the other if there is a "Pzgr 42" scale unfortunately I have nothing on this other than the "simplification" (basic details are wrong- :lol: ) printed in the osprey books. The more recent Sdfkz-234/2 on the other hand used a T.z.f.4B optic as far as I know there is no description of this optic and I have never seen documentation or real life examples either.
There probably was some sort of jury-rigged workaround like was use for HEAT shells for 75mm guns. I think I remember
in the book 'Panzer Gunner' the gunner was suppose to do some math in their head to adjust the scale for certain shells. I don't think a new scale lens would be warranted for the sight.
But, we don't know if the PzGr 42 could be chambered in the KwK 39.

Peasant
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Re: 8,8 cm PzGr 39 Performance

Post by Peasant » 20 Sep 2021 18:59

Peasant wrote:
29 Aug 2019 10:04
Image
I've analyzed these curves and assembled them into a spreadsheet that can be used to estimate the slope multipliers for german projectiles not just at fixed velocities but any in-between those shown in the original graph.

Image

Link: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing

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