High Scorers with Panzers and Paks

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Gastolli
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Re: High Scorers with Panzers and Paks

Post by Gastolli » 05 Nov 2023 11:28

alcius wrote:
05 Nov 2023 10:13
Oberleutnant Gerhard Kleinschmidt - Chef, 2./Stug-Brigade 912 - +7 kills
Hi Antonio,

uh, an overkill on articles on this action I would say :D

Well, the interesting thing is, that the first article is from 2.8.1944, the very day Oblt. Kleinschmidt got the Deutsches Kreuz in Gold. The time it needs to get this award after recommendation, up the chain of command, means, that the action described was AFTER the recommendation was written.

76 tanks destroyed by his battery since Sept. 1943 sounds like the text from the proposal of the DKiG, but I'm not sure of course.

I don't know if Kleinschmidt served with the Sturmartillerie before joining Stug.Abt. 912. He got the EK2 and EK1 in 1941/1942 respectively according to traces-of-war, but maybe with Art.Rgt. 33. In November 1944 he was with Sturmartillerie-Schule.

Oliver

alcius
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Re: High Scorers with Panzers and Paks

Post by alcius » 06 Nov 2023 11:38

Thanks Oliver

Oberleutnant Fritz Zinkhan - Panzerjäger-Abteilung 8 - 5 kills
DKiG on 23/04/1944
With his Sturmgeschütz he destroyed 5 T-34.
1944.02.18 Feldzeitung: Nachrichtenblatt einer Armee im Osten
http://www.periodika.lv/periodika2-view ... L10|page:4

Antonio

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Re: High Scorers with Panzers and Paks

Post by Gastolli » 07 Nov 2023 21:27

alcius wrote:
06 Nov 2023 11:38
Oberleutnant Fritz Zinkhan - Panzerjäger-Abteilung 8 - 5 kills
Hello Antonio,

nice addition. Can't add much details on Fritz Zinkhan. He died 19.3.1944 but got his Deutsches Kreuz in Gold on 23.4.1944, most probably the recommendation was on his way up the chain of command already on his date of death.

The "Schwarzwälder Tageszeitung" from 9.3.1944 also mentions Pz.Jg.Abt. 8 which had big share in the tank kills that time (destroying 116 tanks within 3 weeks), so Oblt. Zinkhan for sure had some of them to his credit:
Schwarzwälder Tageszeitung 09.03.44 - Pz.Jg.Abt. 8 (Troisch).png
See also post #765 from 27.11.2022.

Oliver
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alcius
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Re: High Scorers with Panzers and Paks

Post by alcius » 09 Nov 2023 16:46

Thanks Oliver

I found some articles on panzeraces that I had already posted,
Since they contain more details, I thought I'd post them.

The first is the Hauptmann Wolfgang Everling - Pz.Rgt.36 - KC - with 5 Panther destroyed 17 enemy tanks.
The article states that he personally destroyed 5 tanks.
1945.02.10 Deutsche Zeitung im Ostland
http://www.periodika.lv/periodika2-view ... Panzern%20
P.S. Oberfähnrich Alfred Strauss is also mentioned with 7 kills, I had already posted this too.

Another is Oberfeldwebel Helmut Kauermann -Pz.Rgt.2 -KC for 52 kills
We read that he destroyed 30 enemy tanks in 7 weeks.
Die Heimat am Mittag 96 (11/05/1944) 109

The last one is Oberfeldwebel Georg Morys - Pz.Jg.Abt.181 - KC for 25 kills
There are 2 articles: in one he destroyed 8 enemy tanks, in the second he destroyed 14 enemy tanks and received the KC.

http://www.periodika.lv/periodika2-view ... 3%BCtze%20
1944.09.02 Feldzeitung: Nachrichtenblatt einer Armee im Osten

http://www.periodika.lv/periodika2-view ... er%20ab%20
1944.09.15 Deutsche Zeitung im Ostland

Antonio

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Re: High Scorers with Panzers and Paks

Post by Gastolli » 12 Nov 2023 11:58

alcius wrote:
09 Nov 2023 16:46
Hauptmann Wolfgang Everling - Pz.Rgt.36 - KC - with 5 Panther destroyed 17 enemy tanks.
Oberfähnrich Alfred Strauss is also mentioned with 7 kills, I had already posted this too.
Hello Antonio,

yes, well, but ...

This article here from a few days before gave important details as to the tank kills and the tanks "ausser Gefecht gesetzt" (bewegungsunfähig), the number is 9 kills and 8 damaged = 17 in total.
Deutsche Zeitung im Ostland 28.01.45 - Everling (Pz.Rgt. 36).png
Even we, the Germans, doesn't count the damaged tanks as a kill. The tank in question had to burn, to explode ...

The reason not all the 17 tanks were kills is that the Panthers ended the fight using H.E. rounds, you can see that also in the article from 10.2.1945, where Hptm. Everling had 2 tank kills with his last 3 A.P. rounds, and than damaged another 3 tanks with H.E. rounds.

So, I'm not sure on the total numbers for Everling and Strauss in that particular fight.

Oliver
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Re: High Scorers with Panzers and Paks

Post by Gastolli » 12 Nov 2023 13:07

alcius wrote:
09 Nov 2023 16:46
The last one is Oberfeldwebel Georg Morys - Pz.Jg.Abt.181 - KC for 25 kills
There are 2 articles: in one he destroyed 8 enemy tanks, in the second he destroyed 14 enemy tanks and received the KC.
Hello Antonio,

ah, we have a "downgrade" here, definitely. This one article summarizes the success of Ofw. Morys as being 23 tank kills by his Zug, of whom he had 14 tank kills. So ..., I know the number of "Ritterkreuz für 25 Panzerabschüsse", but this now sounds totally wrong! I would trust this article here.

Oliver

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Re: High Scorers with Panzers and Paks

Post by Gastolli » 12 Nov 2023 13:23

alcius wrote:
09 Nov 2023 16:46
Another is Oberfeldwebel Helmut Kauermann -Pz.Rgt.2 -KC for 52 kills
Die Heimat am Mittag 96 (11/05/1944) 109
Hello Antonio,

here's the link for this article:
https://zeitpunkt.nrw/ulbms/periodical/zoom/16293838

It says 50 tanks, not 52 tanks, but thanks for that link :-)


Oliver

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Re: High Scorers with Panzers and Paks

Post by alcius » 13 Nov 2023 16:06

Thanks Oliver
for clarifications on Everling and Morys

For Kauermann I had put 52 kills, because they are the ones credited.
As per Essener Ritterkreuztrager
kauermann1.png
kauermann.png
or Die Heimat am Mittag (04/06/1944) 82
kauermann2.png
Antonio
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Gastolli
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Re: High Scorers with Panzers and Paks

Post by Gastolli » 13 Nov 2023 19:27

alcius wrote:
13 Nov 2023 16:06
For Kauermann I had put 52 kills, because they are the ones credited.
As per Essener Ritterkreuztrager
Hello Antonio,

ah ..., the newspaper just says 50. But "Essener Ritterkreuzträger" is a book? This one has a fault as it claims Kauermann to have destroyed 12 tanks plus 1 assault-gun, but it was the Zug of Kauermann who destroyed 13 tanks.

Also, "im vergangenen Winter" (during the last winter) is not true, this was the number of his tank kills in Russia, from 1941 onwards.

Anyway, I will put the 52 tank kills into my list as this seems to be the number before he was heavily wounded on 26.3.1944.

Oliver

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Re: High Scorers with Panzers and Paks

Post by alcius » 14 Nov 2023 16:21

I found an article where, I didn't understand if they were talking about PAks or cannons.
Panzerabwerhgeschutzes and panzerjager are mentioned.
There are various names: Unteroffizier Ebner-10 kills and Essig-8 kills, Obergefreiter Bauer and Herzog, and the Feldwebel Hochst with 14 kills (er schoss vierzehn panzer ab).
I couldn't find any of these names and I don't even know the department.
Help
https://digital.wlb-stuttgart.de/sammlu ... 1bcf41baa9
Stuttgarter NS-Kurier 21/8/43

Antonio

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Re: High Scorers with Panzers and Paks

Post by carius » 17 Nov 2023 10:03

High score crew, names?
42 kill rings.jpg
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George

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Re: High Scorers with Panzers and Paks

Post by Gastolli » 18 Nov 2023 18:56

alcius wrote:
14 Nov 2023 16:21
There are various names: Unteroffizier Ebner-10 kills and Essig-8 kills, Obergefreiter Bauer and Herzog, and the Feldwebel Hochst with 14 kills (er schoss vierzehn panzer ab).
Hello Antonio,

ah, well ..., not really easy. We just know that these were heavy fights in the Orel area, newspaper from 21.8.1943, so could have been in August 1943.

And, these men were from an 14.(Pz.Jg.)/G.R. xxx from Schwaben (Swabia). I have no means to figure out the exact unit, unfortunately. This is Infanterie-Pak and I'm no expert in this units.

The only hint could have been Fw. Höchst, who obviously ..., died during these engagements. But there's no Höchst in the Volksbund database. That doesn't mean he was not there, but it's also possible that the names of this PK-Bericht are not correct. Usually, they tell us the real names of the soldiers, but I'm not sure to be true.

Anyway, I broke down this article like this:

Unteroffizier Ebner with Richtschütze Obergefreiter Bauer
On the first day in the forenoon they destroyed 4 tanks (3x 26 tons, 1x 44 tons) with 5 shots at 1.400 m range, than in the afternoon another 6 tanks within 6 to 8 min., the first one a 26 ton tank at 400 m range. After one crew member was wounded and 3 men altogether were absent, Uffz. Ebner as the gunner and Ogfr. Bauer as the loader destroyed another 4 tanks within 1 1/2 hours, the first one a General Lee.
The next day they were attacked by 3 tanks, but the breech was damaged from the artillery fire and they had to blow up their PAK.
This means: Uffz. Ebner with 14 tank kills of thom Ogfr. Bauer had 10 tanks as a Richtschütze!

Unteroffizier Essig
He with his Richtschütze (no name given) destroyed 2 tanks, than the Richtschütze was wounded.
Uffz. Essig than as a gunner destroyed another 6 tanks and fought against soviet Infantery.
This means: Uffz. Essig with 8 tank kills.

Feldwebel Höchst
He during these fights destroyed 14 tanks. Once he destroyed 8 out of 20 attacking tanks, damaged another 4 tanks, the rest broke off the attack. Than he had another tank kill at just 40 m range (a 26 ton tank). He finally was killed (run over) by an soviet tank and the PAK damaged.
This means: Fw. Höchst with 14 tank kills.

Oliver


EDIT:
I got it, was thinking of searching for an Uffz. Essig within the Volksbund database, one Uffz. with that name died on 18.8.1943 and fold3 told me, that he was from 1./Pz.Jg.Abt. 25. So, not the 14.(Pz.Jg.) company from an Grenadier-Regiment, but an Panzerjäger-Abteilung, so here are all the men from above:

Uffz. Alfred Ebner (1./Pz.Jg.Abt. 25), died June 1944, Minsk area
Ogfr. Ferdinand Bauer (1./Pz.Jg.Abt. 25), not in Volksbund database
Uffz. Ernst Essig (1./Pz.Jg.Abt. 25), died 18.8.1943 near Bujanowo
Ofw. Roman Höchst (2./Pz.Jg.Abt. 25), died 31.7.1943, obviously was promoted p.h.

Höchst got the EK2 on 27.7.1943 and the EK1 p.h. on 14.8.1943.
Ebner and Essig got the EK1 on 6.8.1943, while Bauer got the EK2 this day.

:-)
Last edited by Gastolli on 18 Nov 2023 19:33, edited 1 time in total.

Gastolli
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Re: High Scorers with Panzers and Paks

Post by Gastolli » 18 Nov 2023 19:24

carius wrote:
17 Nov 2023 10:03
High score crew, names?
Hello carius ...

I'm not sure, I'm also not sure if this here is an Fahnenjunker-Wachtmeister or an Oberwachtmeister?

Could be Wachtmeister Trägner from Stug.Abt. 667, wo got the Ritterkreuz after he was wounded 15.8.1943 and said to had 44 tank kills in total up to that date.

Or Oberwachtmeister Riehl from Stug.Abt. 909, wo got the Deutsches Kreuz in Gold in September 1943 and an newspaper article from 17.8.1943 claimes, that he had reached his 41st tank kill in Russia.

But I'm no expert in recognising faces or so. Please keep in mind that the Sturmartillerie had a lot of tank-killer-aces amongst their personnel, even above 40 claimed kills ...

Oliver

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Re: High Scorers with Panzers and Paks

Post by carius » 19 Nov 2023 19:07

Gastolli wrote:
18 Nov 2023 19:24
carius wrote:
17 Nov 2023 10:03
High score crew, names?
Hello carius ...

I'm not sure, I'm also not sure if this here is an Fahnenjunker-Wachtmeister or an Oberwachtmeister?

Could be Wachtmeister Trägner from Stug.Abt. 667, wo got the Ritterkreuz after he was wounded 15.8.1943 and said to had 44 tank kills in total up to that date.

Or Oberwachtmeister Riehl from Stug.Abt. 909, wo got the Deutsches Kreuz in Gold in September 1943 and an newspaper article from 17.8.1943 claimes, that he had reached his 41st tank kill in Russia.

But I'm no expert in recognising faces or so. Please keep in mind that the Sturmartillerie had a lot of tank-killer-aces amongst their personnel, even above 40 claimed kills ...

Oliver
Thank you Oliver!
George

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Re: High Scorers with Panzers and Paks

Post by alcius » 20 Nov 2023 11:26

Thanks Oliver, great!!!

There is also a photo of this.
Unteroffizier Kurt Basan - Geschützführer, 1. / Pz.Jg.Abt.225 - 4 kills
Anerkennungsurkunde des Oberbefehlshabers des Heeres 25/08/1944

Feldzeitung: Nachrichtenblatt einer Armee im Osten 17/08/1944
basan.png
Antonio
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