Panther Bodenturm

Discussions on the fortifications, artillery, & rockets used by the Axis forces.
herring
Member
Posts: 419
Joined: 18 Apr 2003 16:54
Location: Poland

Post by herring » 20 Sep 2005 20:20

Jopaerya,

Yes, I know these structures, they also had much bigger steel bunker for AT field gun... I agree - idea of steel bunkers wasn't german invention.


Tommygunn,

That's the map, that drives me crazy!
For sure, there are tobruks north-west of Fornaci, also one is missing on the map - south of the road.

The AT bunker, north of Fornaci - I didn't find it, the terrain is terrible there - very steep hills, totally overgrown with vegetation. I've almost lost my legs there. Have you seen it? And - did you determine the type?

In my opinion, it is possible that two stutzpunkts might be built there - I doubt if someone could make such a big mistake with locating a group of bunkers.

regards
herring

User avatar
Andrzej Ditrich
Member
Posts: 1800
Joined: 27 Sep 2004 17:51
Location: Gdansk/Sopot/Gdynia

Post by Andrzej Ditrich » 20 Sep 2005 20:50

Hello
Thanks to all for help!

Just my 5 cents
-purpose of Riminis Pantherturms:
they were rather for anti-landing defence (close to the beach) then protection of airfield....

Brgds
@ndrew

herring
Member
Posts: 419
Joined: 18 Apr 2003 16:54
Location: Poland

Post by herring » 20 Sep 2005 22:06

Well, I can't agree..

These on airdfield had very good field of fire (I don't think it was intended to defend an airfield, it was placed in such a place, where it could destroy as many allied vehicles as possible) , this at the road (third one!) was to defend a road itself. All of them were placed quite far away from the beach. In case of invasion, they would rather act as inland defences than a coastal defences (although primarly some were used as coastal defences!!)

regards
herring

User avatar
Tommygunn
Member
Posts: 204
Joined: 05 Apr 2005 19:21
Location: Italy

Post by Tommygunn » 20 Sep 2005 22:24

Herring,
I'm surprised you didn't find it as it is in the patch of cultivated pine and very accesible. I've just been looking at Multimap.com on a scale similar to the French map and I think that the Bunker is too far to the right which means that my Tobruks and Pantherturm also. I have corrected this in the attachment I include. This map makes more sense because if you look rearward from the bunker roof you have the small lake and both the bunker and lower Tobruk are hidden by the pine trees. It also makes sense for my presumed site of the Pantherturm as immediately behind the field was the road snaking away.
Now the reason I placed the Pantherturm in this location was from using the two photos in my previous attachment which shows the gun/turret looking down the valley, with the road bend in the distance, and then in the other shot with the hillside and destroyed house. I was unable to locate any house ruins but there are certainly new buildings there now with the road between. I just have this feeling that the French map data is incorrect.

I can't get precise match on the bunker type but the closest it comes to is an R669 or an R680. You can see from the period photos on http://www.gothic-line.com that there appear to be 75mm pak shells lying in front of it.

(Off Topic)
This leads me onto the next problem as there appears to be two AT Bunkers. Firstly the one which I include and which is documented in the period photos but also there are other contemporary photos on Gothic-line.com which are not the same bunker. See 'Gothic Line battlefields today' link Gallery 3 & 4. Where this 'clean' bunker is I do not know!

Your thoughts.

p.s. it was just outside of this bunker that my metal detector found a Falschirmjäger/officer Y-strap hook.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

herring
Member
Posts: 419
Joined: 18 Apr 2003 16:54
Location: Poland

Post by herring » 21 Sep 2005 00:21

I see I've been looking too close to Fornaci.
Only way to determine a type of bunker is to measure it.
The second AT bunker is over water factory in Panna.

It's a real pity, that this year I'm not planning a trip to Italy.....

regards
herring

User avatar
Tommygunn
Member
Posts: 204
Joined: 05 Apr 2005 19:21
Location: Italy

Post by Tommygunn » 21 Sep 2005 02:14

Where exactly is Panna and the water factory as I couldn't get a location on a map search?
Thanks.

herring
Member
Posts: 419
Joined: 18 Apr 2003 16:54
Location: Poland

Post by herring » 21 Sep 2005 09:38

Looking at map above, more or less where plate with number of a road "SP39" is placed

regards
herring

User avatar
Tommygunn
Member
Posts: 204
Joined: 05 Apr 2005 19:21
Location: Italy

Post by Tommygunn » 21 Sep 2005 10:26

Yep, got it now on the computer map.
Thanks.

jopaerya
Member
Posts: 18498
Joined: 21 Jun 2004 13:21
Location: middelburg

Post by jopaerya » 16 Mar 2006 22:19

Hello All

Who has visited the bunker for a Pantherturret at
the Perthus at the border of France and Spain ?

Regards Jos

2nd panzer
Member
Posts: 34
Joined: 03 Jan 2006 00:07
Location: ohio

other tank turrets

Post by 2nd panzer » 01 Apr 2006 01:15

hi;
i know this is about pantherturm but was there not other german turrets mounted this way?
i saw a pic. of i think a mark iv turret in a book on d-day

bob

Jan-Hendrik
Member
Posts: 8254
Joined: 11 Nov 2004 12:53
Location: Hohnhorst / Deutschland

Post by Jan-Hendrik » 01 Apr 2006 09:32

Is it possible that 5 mountings for a Pantherbodenturm were placed in the area around Küstrin in 1945 ??

Jan-Hendrik

User avatar
Vincent S.
Member
Posts: 214
Joined: 19 Aug 2005 11:10
Location: Belgium, near "Kleidungslager Herentals"

Post by Vincent S. » 04 Apr 2006 09:11

A Panther turm in Berlin
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

User avatar
Vincent S.
Member
Posts: 214
Joined: 19 Aug 2005 11:10
Location: Belgium, near "Kleidungslager Herentals"

Post by Vincent S. » 04 Apr 2006 10:01

A Panther turm in Berlin
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

jopaerya
Member
Posts: 18498
Joined: 21 Jun 2004 13:21
Location: middelburg

Post by jopaerya » 04 Apr 2006 20:05

Hello Tankturretfans

On this photo from a Pantherturret in Italy
you can see that the turret has a different
commandkuppel , normally the Panther turret
has 2 versions of the commandkuppel , the
early box shape version and the later version
with the vision ports .
Is this version on this turret especially made
for the fixed Pantherturret ?

Photo = Sikorski Museum

Reagards Jos
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

User avatar
Big Al P
Member
Posts: 116
Joined: 14 Aug 2004 13:37
Location: Calhoun Tn

Post by Big Al P » 05 Apr 2006 15:08

In the picture in Berlin you can see a couple of full rounds mixed in with all the
empty cases,would these be misfires?And yes I think they were designed
with this turret,I have a model kit of one and it has a turret like this on it.
Also, I think these turrets were made with thicker armor from the factory.

Return to “Fortifications, Artillery, & Rockets”