5cm Maschinengranatwerfer M19
- P. Heijkoop
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- M19 MADMAL
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- Location: M19 Mortar Bunker. STRONGPOINT CORBIERE. Jersey. Channel Islands
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Re: 5cm Maschinengranatwerfer M19
Hi all,
Some photos of a tool chest for the M19.
(had these photos for years and I think it belongs to a collector in Guernsey )
Enjoy
Malcolm
Some photos of a tool chest for the M19.
(had these photos for years and I think it belongs to a collector in Guernsey )
Enjoy
Malcolm
- Attachments
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- The tool chest
- m19c 001.jpg (43.01 KiB) Viewed 1608 times
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- close up of the name plate
- m19c 002.jpg (64.63 KiB) Viewed 1611 times
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- Rheinmetal & Borzig stamp (think that's spelt right?)
- m19c 006.jpg (64.22 KiB) Viewed 1607 times
"I had expected only ruins", "It's as if I had only left the bunker yesterday!"
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
- M19 MADMAL
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- Joined: 08 Dec 2005, 17:42
- Location: M19 Mortar Bunker. STRONGPOINT CORBIERE. Jersey. Channel Islands
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Re: 5cm Maschinengranatwerfer M19
Some more of the inside with a very nice contents label
Enjoy
Malcolm
Enjoy
Malcolm
- Attachments
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- m19c 005.jpg (65.38 KiB) Viewed 1597 times
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- m19c 003.jpg (69.41 KiB) Viewed 1594 times
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- Close up of the contents list. NICE!!!
- m19c 004.jpg (70.49 KiB) Viewed 1592 times
"I had expected only ruins", "It's as if I had only left the bunker yesterday!"
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
- P. Heijkoop
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- Posts: 718
- Joined: 29 Feb 2004, 19:20
- Location: Middelburg, The Netherlands
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Re: 5cm Maschinengranatwerfer M19
Ooh,
very nice. I suppose the tool themselve are missing
Peter
very nice. I suppose the tool themselve are missing
Peter
- M19 MADMAL
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Re: 5cm Maschinengranatwerfer M19
Hi Peter,
Yep you got it. No tools
Does anybody know what the significance is of the 'R142A' & the Nr. below it (?) on the muzzle of the M19 photo below??
Am I correct in saying that only 98 M19s were made which makes me wonder why the Nr.142.
As this part of the barrel was just a cover/guide for the proper barrel to slide up and down in is it prehaps designed to be 'sacrifical' and could be replaced if it was damaged by shrapnel and the like?
Malcolm
Photo from Google Earth
Yep you got it. No tools
Does anybody know what the significance is of the 'R142A' & the Nr. below it (?) on the muzzle of the M19 photo below??
Am I correct in saying that only 98 M19s were made which makes me wonder why the Nr.142.
As this part of the barrel was just a cover/guide for the proper barrel to slide up and down in is it prehaps designed to be 'sacrifical' and could be replaced if it was damaged by shrapnel and the like?
Malcolm
Photo from Google Earth
- Attachments
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- detail.jpg (48.67 KiB) Viewed 1501 times
"I had expected only ruins", "It's as if I had only left the bunker yesterday!"
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
- P. Heijkoop
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- Posts: 718
- Joined: 29 Feb 2004, 19:20
- Location: Middelburg, The Netherlands
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Re: 5cm Maschinengranatwerfer M19
Hi Malcolm,
I know the weapon had it's unique number stamped everywhere on it's part and I suppose
nr 142 is one example of it..
If this means that the M19 were produced in 100+ numberm, perhaps that's true.
Peter
I know the weapon had it's unique number stamped everywhere on it's part and I suppose
nr 142 is one example of it..
If this means that the M19 were produced in 100+ numberm, perhaps that's true.
Peter
- M19 MADMAL
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Re: 5cm Maschinengranatwerfer M19
Hi All,
A couple of pics of the type 633 M19 bunker at Mont Lambert, France from Atlantikwall Super Forum and posted by 'tof';
http://atlantikwall.superforum.fr/nord- ... -t1865.htm
The first shows the ammunition room still with the loading tables and the ammo storage racks . A lot of damage caused by the turret being removed can be seen around the door to to turret room with a lot of re-bars visible and a hole has been blown through the upper-left corner allowing tons of infill to pour in
The second is looking into the ammo room from the ventilation room and the Schwungscheibe is still in place. From the marks on the wall it looks like the bunker totally floods up to the roof
Malcolm
A couple of pics of the type 633 M19 bunker at Mont Lambert, France from Atlantikwall Super Forum and posted by 'tof';
http://atlantikwall.superforum.fr/nord- ... -t1865.htm
The first shows the ammunition room still with the loading tables and the ammo storage racks . A lot of damage caused by the turret being removed can be seen around the door to to turret room with a lot of re-bars visible and a hole has been blown through the upper-left corner allowing tons of infill to pour in
The second is looking into the ammo room from the ventilation room and the Schwungscheibe is still in place. From the marks on the wall it looks like the bunker totally floods up to the roof
Malcolm
- Attachments
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- 610.jpg (30.29 KiB) Viewed 1429 times
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- 510.jpg (41.61 KiB) Viewed 1428 times
"I had expected only ruins", "It's as if I had only left the bunker yesterday!"
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
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- Location: Denmark
Re: 5cm Maschinengranatwerfer M19
Hello
I think that there were produced more than the 98.
In his last "Typenheft" Rudi Rolf mentions 73 Regelbau-bunkers for M 19 as built alone in the Atlantic Wall. In Esbjerg/Denmark further four were under construction when the war ended.
Some M 19 (how many?) were also used in Submarinebunkers. And it would seem that at least some weapons were kept in the Ostwall (at least two) and the Westwall.
I know of the following numbers:
Hanstholm/Denmark - L 107
Agger/Denmark - 135
Wehrteknischen Studiensammlung - 188A
Where was the pictures on the top of the page, showing the number R 142A taken?
Best regards
Jens
I think that there were produced more than the 98.
In his last "Typenheft" Rudi Rolf mentions 73 Regelbau-bunkers for M 19 as built alone in the Atlantic Wall. In Esbjerg/Denmark further four were under construction when the war ended.
Some M 19 (how many?) were also used in Submarinebunkers. And it would seem that at least some weapons were kept in the Ostwall (at least two) and the Westwall.
I know of the following numbers:
Hanstholm/Denmark - L 107
Agger/Denmark - 135
Wehrteknischen Studiensammlung - 188A
Where was the pictures on the top of the page, showing the number R 142A taken?
Best regards
Jens
- M19 MADMAL
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Re: 5cm Maschinengranatwerfer M19
Hi Jens,
The photo is of the M19 on Fanö, Denmark.
Apart from the 73 Type 633's I know of 2 M19 bunkers on U Boat bases which are at St Nazaire and in Norway where only the turret was installed.
32 'B Werk' bunkers were constructed and each of them was (I guess) fitted with a M19 and I understand that 14 were installed on the East Wall.
Don't know how many (if any) Type 135 & 136's were constructed to mount a M19.
There was also at least 2 training M19's
The first was the M19 im Schiessbok which was a M19 mounted on a Sonderanhanger 101 twin axle trailer which would provide a crew to drill on the weapon under the type of training supervision which would have been inpossible within the close confines of a M19 turret.
The Second was a M19 in a training cupola made of concrete or Ubungsturm. Using this device crews could get use to opperating a M19 within the confined turret.
If I have got it right that's a total of at least 123 M19's
Malcolm
The photo is of the M19 on Fanö, Denmark.
Apart from the 73 Type 633's I know of 2 M19 bunkers on U Boat bases which are at St Nazaire and in Norway where only the turret was installed.
32 'B Werk' bunkers were constructed and each of them was (I guess) fitted with a M19 and I understand that 14 were installed on the East Wall.
Don't know how many (if any) Type 135 & 136's were constructed to mount a M19.
There was also at least 2 training M19's
The first was the M19 im Schiessbok which was a M19 mounted on a Sonderanhanger 101 twin axle trailer which would provide a crew to drill on the weapon under the type of training supervision which would have been inpossible within the close confines of a M19 turret.
The Second was a M19 in a training cupola made of concrete or Ubungsturm. Using this device crews could get use to opperating a M19 within the confined turret.
If I have got it right that's a total of at least 123 M19's
Malcolm
"I had expected only ruins", "It's as if I had only left the bunker yesterday!"
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
- M19 MADMAL
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Re:
Hi Peter,
But where from
In the 5 M19 bunkers I have been inside none of them have any trace of a cable supply to the Schwungscheibe from the bunker's own electrical wiring for lighting, air pump motors etc. The Schwungscheibe was completely independent so I guess that most never had a electric motor fitted and had to use only the 'Handantreib' to opperate the mortar.
Or was there another means to get power to the Schwungscheibe electric motor?
Malcolm
So the supply for the motor in the Schwungscheibe must have been from an external sourceP. Heijkoop wrote: Just checked my sources and indeed in the lower part of the Schwungscheibe an electromotor could be placed.
This would switch on when turning the handle from Hand- to Motorantrieb. However, the currency for this motor was not generated by the turn-wheel.
But where from
In the 5 M19 bunkers I have been inside none of them have any trace of a cable supply to the Schwungscheibe from the bunker's own electrical wiring for lighting, air pump motors etc. The Schwungscheibe was completely independent so I guess that most never had a electric motor fitted and had to use only the 'Handantreib' to opperate the mortar.
Or was there another means to get power to the Schwungscheibe electric motor?
Malcolm
"I had expected only ruins", "It's as if I had only left the bunker yesterday!"
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
- P. Heijkoop
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- Posts: 718
- Joined: 29 Feb 2004, 19:20
- Location: Middelburg, The Netherlands
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Re: 5cm Maschinengranatwerfer M19
Hi Malcolm,
With some M19s I've seen some additional wiring close to the Schwungscheibe. What I remember
is that these looked like they were added later on. Would have to check that at home.
With regard to motorised M19s, we know for sure that the M19s of the Kernwerk Ijmuiden were power
driven. In some of the bunkers in this Kernwerk (e.g. a 631) you can see remains for a small generator in the Nahkampfraum. Perhaps this was also the case with the m19 and that's how it was driven in this specific case...
Peter
With some M19s I've seen some additional wiring close to the Schwungscheibe. What I remember
is that these looked like they were added later on. Would have to check that at home.
With regard to motorised M19s, we know for sure that the M19s of the Kernwerk Ijmuiden were power
driven. In some of the bunkers in this Kernwerk (e.g. a 631) you can see remains for a small generator in the Nahkampfraum. Perhaps this was also the case with the m19 and that's how it was driven in this specific case...
Peter
Re: 5cm Maschinengranatwerfer M19
The number for Norway also need to be ajusted a little....In his last "Typenheft" Rudi Rolf mentions 73 Regelbau-bunkers for M 19 as built alone in the Atlantic Wall.
No idea how many M-19 actually got operational here, but so far we managed to find 10 R633`s! In addition comes the allready mentioned on the submarinebunker "Bruno". Last but not least a blown up SK for M-19 connected to an undergroundsystem at MKB Mestersand outside Kirkenes.... Those "10 confirmed" is a number which most likely will rise, as there are still "indications" that a few more are still hiding out there somewhere
Rgds
Erik E
- M19 MADMAL
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Re: 5cm Maschinengranatwerfer M19
Hi all,
While digging though all my papers on M19s I found the following that might be of interest
After the completion of 10 of these emplacements the assembly was re-disigned. Except for 5 which were installed on a so-called shooting support for testing, 22 weapons were available for installation, there were 880 pieces planned. In March 1945 316,700 mortar rounds lay in different stores.
Weapons and secret weapons of the German Army 1933-1945 by Fritz Cock Volume 1.
Source: http://www.iba-informationen.de in 2005 (a site that does now exist again Thanks TH )
Interesting that the M19 was re-disigned. The photos of examples not mounted into bunkers have a electric motor mounted on the weapon under the barrel. But all the 'installed' examples in war time photos or that have survived had the motor moved into the Schwungscheibe (if it was even fitted). And that the soure states that 880 M19's were planned
Malcolm
While digging though all my papers on M19s I found the following that might be of interest
After the completion of 10 of these emplacements the assembly was re-disigned. Except for 5 which were installed on a so-called shooting support for testing, 22 weapons were available for installation, there were 880 pieces planned. In March 1945 316,700 mortar rounds lay in different stores.
Weapons and secret weapons of the German Army 1933-1945 by Fritz Cock Volume 1.
Source: http://www.iba-informationen.de in 2005 (a site that does now exist again Thanks TH )
Interesting that the M19 was re-disigned. The photos of examples not mounted into bunkers have a electric motor mounted on the weapon under the barrel. But all the 'installed' examples in war time photos or that have survived had the motor moved into the Schwungscheibe (if it was even fitted). And that the soure states that 880 M19's were planned
Malcolm
Last edited by M19 MADMAL on 27 May 2008, 18:50, edited 2 times in total.
"I had expected only ruins", "It's as if I had only left the bunker yesterday!"
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
Re: 5cm Maschinengranatwerfer M19
Attached examples taken in the very same bunker: All weaponparts are stamped "R153A" or just "153"I know the weapon had it's unique number stamped everywhere on it's part and I suppose
nr 142 is one example of it..
The platform + weaponframe itself is marked "125" with paint
The copular Nr. is "143"
PS:
Do we know for sure that the seralnumbers didn`t start at 100?
Rgds Erik E
- Attachments
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- M19 R153A.JPG (52.89 KiB) Viewed 1173 times
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- M19 125.JPG (55.79 KiB) Viewed 1174 times
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- M19 143.JPG (50.36 KiB) Viewed 1174 times
Re: 5cm Maschinengranatwerfer M19
If you add a little 'r' it exists! ;)iba-informationen.deSource: http://www.iba-infomationen.de in 2005 (a site that does not exist anymore? )