33. Waff.Gren.Div. der SS "Charlemagne"(franz. Nr. 1)

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33. Waff.Gren.Div. der SS "Charlemagne"(franz. Nr. 1)

Post by Endzeit Jan » 29 Feb 2008 09:21

Hi
Search Informations from:
Reserve-Rgt. Charlemagne --SS-Stubaf. Victor de Bourmount
1. Marsch-Rgt.3 3 --SS-Stubaf. Emile Raybound
2. Marsch-Rgt. 33 --SS-Ostubaf. Heinrich Hersche
SS-Freiw.Rgt. 33 Charlemagne --SS-Staf. Walter Zimmermann
-Marsch-Btl. 33 Charlemagne --SS-Stubaf. Katzian
-Marsch-Btl. 33 Charlemagne --SS-Stubaf. von Lohöffel

Thanks Jan
Last edited by Endzeit Jan on 02 Mar 2008 14:23, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: SS-Div.-Charlemange

Post by Phil Don » 29 Feb 2008 09:57

Hi

In feb 1945 : 33. Waffen-Grenadier-Division der SS Charlemagne (franz. Nr. 1) with 2 regiments
Rgt 57, commander Hstuf. Victor de BOURMONT
Rgt 58, commander Stubaf. Emile RAYBAUD

During the battle of Pomerania, the 2 regiments were changed in the SS-Marsch-Regiment 33 (the valids and the high-morale), commander Stubaf Emile RAYBAUD, and the SS-Reserve-Regiment 33 (the others), commander Hstuf. de BOURMONT.

After the battle of Pomerania, with the destruction of the reserve regiment by soviets, the SS FHA decide to restructure the division in only a regiment, the Französisches Freiwilligen Sturm Regiment der SS Charlemagne (I don’t think it have the number 33, commander Staf Walter ZIMMERMANN).

During the same time, the Ostubaf Heinrich HERSCHE, commander of the Französische SS Grenadier Ausbildungs und Ersatz Bataillon, organize all the french soldiers of the training camp of Wildfleken (supply troops, his bataillon and more). They were around 1 200. It’s here that many writers name this unit as a new french march regiment (sometime numbered wrongly 59 because of the 57 and 58 of the division). It seemed more that the name Französische SS Grenadier Ausbildungs und Ersatz Bataillon stay even if the soldiers were grouped in 2 battalions commanded by Stubaf Katzian and von Lohöffel.

Phil.

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Re: SS-Div.-Charlemange

Post by Endzeit Jan » 29 Feb 2008 18:26

Thanks
From what was the division then set up again? Ostubaf. Hersche troops nevertheless remained in Bavaria. Or?

Jan

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Re: SS-Div.-Charlemange

Post by Phil Don » 29 Feb 2008 21:09

Hi

At the end of the battle of Pomerania, when the french regiments try to to join the german lines, the order of march was :
1 battalion / March Rgt (commander Hstuf FENET) with the division stab
all the reserve regiment (with two battalions Hstuf MONNEUSE and BERRET
2 battalion / March Rgt (commander Hstuf BASSOMPIERRE) in protection of the retreat, fighting red army in the city of Körlin.
The reserve regiment was destroyed behind Belgard and the 2/March Rgt destroyed during the fighting. Only the battalion Fenet succeed to join the german line, walking on the beach of the Baltic sea.

The Französisches Freiwilligen Sturm Regiment der SS Charlemagne officially group all the surviving soldiers:
- the Franzosische SS Grenadier Ausbildungs und Ersatz Bataillon
- all the supply troops who don’t go to Pomerania (commander Stubaf BOUDET-GHEUSI with all the heavy troops, Pak, Flak) or who stay with the german lines
- the Fenet battalion (the only complete)
- all the surviving groups who succeed to join across soviet lines to Danzig (commander Hstuf OBITZ then Hstuf MARTIN, they fight with the 4 SS Polizei Division and were ship to Danmark on 01/04/1045; then they join the depot)
- the surviving soldiers (near 500) who join Kolberg (commander Hstuf HAVARD) and were members of the artillery abteilung of the division. They were evacued by sea too and join later.

The goal of KRUKENBERG was to group all the surviving soldiers who join every day the german lines (even members of the reserve regiment who walk in the forest and pass between the russian troops). Little by little 100 / 200 / 300 join the country of Anklam. More, all the member of the sturmgeschutz battery who were in school in Protektorat join with a new promotion of Oberjunker from Neweklau.
The organisation of the regiment was with 2 grenadier battalions (battalion 57 with Hstuf FENET and battalion 58 with Ostuf GEROMINI) and the heavy battalion of Stubaf BOUDET-GHEUSI.
It is at this moment (24 april) that KRUKENBERG receive the order to join Berlin with a battalion and he chose the Fenet’s one. Their fight in Berlin was more known.
After their departure, Stubaf BOUDET-GHEUSI take command of the rest (Staf ZIMMERMANN was in an hospital because he was hurt in Pomerania). He try to join Danmark but the road was cut by the british troops. Then try to join the Mecklembourg and they were capture on 02/05/1945.

During this time, in Wildflecken, the Franzosische SS Grenadier Ausbildungs und Ersatz Bataillon (Ostubaf HERSCHE) receive order leave the camp. His first intention was to join KRUKENBERG but he was already in Berlin (we were after the 24/04). Then HERSCHE receive order from the SS HA (Obergruppenführer BERGER) to go to the south, Bavaria and the Alpine redoubt. They leave Wildfleken on 29/30 april. During the travel (by train and by feet) he “give” 2 or 3 company to fight with the 38 SS Division Nibelungen for an anti tank fight. Finaly half of the regiment join Austria near Insbruck and some pass to Italia and surrender to allied troops in Bolzano in Tyrol on 13/05/1945. I have read that 4 members of this last column were decorated on order of Obergruppenführer WOLFF HSSPf Italien. One of them was Ostubaf GAMORY-DUBOURDEAU the former commander of the french Sturmbrigade but too old for commanding a regiment in Pomerania (he was the first commander of the regiment 57 before replaced by Hstuf de BOURMONT.

Regards

Phil.

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Re: SS-Div.-Charlemange

Post by Endzeit Jan » 01 Mar 2008 08:56

Hi
Phil, its great work!!! 8-)
It is Order on Battle or other?
Sorry my English is not good.

Gliederung der 33.Waffen-Grenadier-Division der SS "Charlemagne" (franz.Nr.1): Stand 25.03.1945

Waffen-Gren.Reg.d.SS 57 (franz.Nr.1)--- I.-III.Btl. (III. ist Sturm-Btl.)

SS-Jagd-Pz.Kp.33

SS-Pz.Jg.Kp.33

SS-Art.Abt.33 (franz.Nr.1)

SS-Fla.Kp.33

SS-Nachr.Kp.33

SS-Pz.Zg.33 (?)

SS-Pi.Kp.33

SS-San.Kp.33

SS-Vet.Kp.33

SS-Werkstatt-Kp.33

Jan

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Re: SS-Div.-Charlemange

Post by Phil Don » 01 Mar 2008 15:14

Hi Jan

The gliederung you propose is not the one on 25/03/1945 because at this date many of theses units don’t exist anymore.

Here what I have but it is very difficult to have the verity (very often in books soldiers are named with pseudonyms)

Französische Freiwilligen Sturm Regiment der SS Charlemagne
Commander Staf Walter ZIMMERMANN
Deputy Hstuf KROEPSCH
SS Bataillon 57 Hstuf Henri FENET
1 Kp Ustuf LABOURDETTE
2 Kp Haupscharführer HENNECARD then Ostuf Pierre MICHEL
3 Kp ?
4 Kp Oberscharf OLLIVIER
SS Bataillon 58 Ostuf Jean Baptiste GERONIMI then Hstuf Hans Robert JAUSS
(KRUKENBERG don’t want GERONIMI as commander, even volunteer for fighting, because, former milician, he was politicaly too friend with his old chief, Joseph DARNAND)
5 Kp Ostuf FANTIN
6 Kp Hauptscharf Pierre ROSTAIN
7 Kp Ustuf LEUNE
Heavy Battalion Stubaf Jean BOUDET-GHEUSI
Pak Kp Ostuf Serge KROTOFF
Flak Kp Ustuf René FAYARD
Pi Kp Ostuf Roger AUDIBERT
Sturmgeschutz Kp I don’t know if it was still existing

Out of the regiment and directly with Generalinspekteur KRUKENBERG:
Divisionkampfschule (around a company)
Ostuf Wilhelm WEBER


The artillerie abteilung don’t exists at this moment. They fight, as infantry because they don’t receive canons in Kolberg in Pomerania.
The supply units (sanitary company, veterinar company, signal company and werkstatt company) were not in first line in Pomerania and were still existing. Some, even, were still in Wildfleken.

Veterinar Kp Hstuf Jean RICHERT (I’m not sure of his first name)
Sanitary Kp Hstuf Pierre Auguste BONNEFOY
Signal Kp Ostuf Jean DUPUYAU
Werkstatt Kp Ostuf Henri MAUDHUIT


With surviving soldiers of Pomerania who don’t want to continue fighting, they were disarm and form a little Bau Bataillon under the orders of Hstuf Robert ROY (not satisfied of this post because he wants to fight).

The “Sturmbataillon” who went to Berlin with KRUKENBERG and FENET was composed of the 4 companies of his own battalion and one of the battalion 58. Some trucks don’t succed to join Berlin and around 300 / 320 french SS were in the city. Then FENET organise his battalion in 4 companies (LABOURDETTE, MICHEL, ROSTAING ans OLLIVIER).

Here what I have but other could have better informations.

Regards

Phil.

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Re: SS-Div.-Charlemange

Post by Endzeit Jan » 01 Mar 2008 18:43

Thanks Phil, very thanks
Has you Stellenbesetzung from this 33.SS-Div.?
And Phil, How find Stellenbesetzung from Stab 15.SS-Div.??
Jan

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Re: 33.Waffen-Grenadier-Division der SS "Charlemange"

Post by Phil Don » 01 Mar 2008 20:02

Excuse me Jan but what mean Stellenbesetzung ? Is it the posts in the division's staff (Ia, Ib, Ic, ...) ?

Phil.

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Re: 33.Waffen-Grenadier-Division der SS "Charlemange"

Post by Endzeit Jan » 01 Mar 2008 20:36

yes, yes :D

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Re: 33.Waffen-Grenadier-Division der SS "Charlemange"

Post by Juanjo » 01 Mar 2008 22:33

Hi Jan

33º Waffen Grenadier Division der Waffen SS “Charlemagne
Kdr.:
Waffen-Oberführer Edgar Puaud
Chief of Staff
Waffen-Sturmbannführer Jean de Vaugelas
Orders Officer
Waffen-Obersturmführer Michel Auphan
Waffen-Standartenjunker Claude Platon
IA
Waffen-Sturmbannführer Jean de Vaugelas
IC
Waffen-Untersturmführer ? Delile
IIAB
Waffen-Obersturmführer Maurice Benetoux
IVB
Waffen-Sturmbannführer Max Lelongt
IVC
Waffen-Hauptsturmführer Jean Richert
IVD
Waffen-Sturmbannführer Jean Mayol de Lupé
Waffen-Untersturmführer Just Verney
VI
SS-UntersturmfÜhrer Heinrich Büeler
Military Police
Waffen-Obersturmführer Guillaume Veyrieras
Civil Defence
Waffen-Obersturmführer ? Multrier
German Liaison Officer
Sturmbannführer Erich Von Lölhoffel

DIVISIONAL UNITS.-
Honour Company
SS.Obersturmführer Wilhelm Weber
Staff Company
Waffen-Hauptscharführer ? Surrel
Signals Company
Waffen-Obersturmführer Jean Dupuyau
Engineer Company
Waffen-Obersturmführer Roger Audibert
Adjutant
Waffen-Untersturmführer Jean Mailhe
Medical Company
Waffen-Hauptsturmführer ? Peribere
Waffen-Hauptsturmführer Pierre Bonnefoy
Veterinary Company
Waffen-Untersturmführer Jean Richter
Workshop Company
Waffen-Obersturmführer Henri Maud’huit
Construction Company
Waffen-Obersturmführer ? de Moroge
Fahrschwadron A
Waffen-Hauptsturmführer ? Schlisler
Fachschwadron B
Waffen-Hauptsturmführer Jean Croisille

WAFFEN GRENADIER REGIMENT DER WAFFEN SS 57
Kdr.:
Waffen-Hauptsturmführer Viktor de Bourmont
Adjutant
Waffen-Obersturmführer Jean Artus
Orders Officer
Waffen-Untersturmführer Christian Martret
Waffen-Obersturmführer ? de Londaize
III
Waffen-Untersturmführer Jean Marie Stehli
IVB
Waffen-Hauptsturmführer ? Leproux
IVC
Waffen-Obersturmführer Jean Vergnaud
Staff Company
Waffen-Obersturmführer ? André

9ª Company
Waffen-Hauptsturmführer Robert Roy
10ª Company
Waffen-Obersturmführer ? Labuze

I Battalion
Kdr.:
Waffen-Hauptsturmführer Henri Fenet
Adjutant
Waffen-Untersturmführer Pierre Hug
Orders Officer
Waffen-Standartenoberjunker Jean Labourdette
IVB
Waffen-Standartenoberjunker Louis Anneshaensel
1ª Company
Waffen-Untersturmführer Jean Brazier
2ª Company
Waffen-Obersturmführer Ivan Bartolomei
3ª Company
Waffen-Untersturmführer Guy Counil
4ª Company
Waffen-Oberscharführer ? Couvreur

II Battalion
Kdr.:
Waffen-Hauptsturmführer René André Obitz
Adjutant
Waffen-Obersturmführer ? Roumegous
IVB
Waffen-Untersturmführer Marcel Louis Herpe
Waffen-Hauptsturmführer Roger Duflos
5ª Company
Waffen-Oberscharführer ? Hennecart
6ª Company
Waffen-Untersturmführer Pierre Albert
7ª Company
Waffen-Standartenoberjunker ? Million-Rousseau
8ª Company
Waffen-Untersturmführer Philippe Colnion

WAFFEN GRENADIER REGIMENT DER WAFFEN SS 58
Kdr.:
Waffen-Sturmbannführer Emilie Raybaud
Adjutant
Waffen-Obersturmführer Marcel Baudouin
Orders Officer
Waffen-Standartenoberjunker ? de Vaugelas
III
Waffen-Hauptsturmführer Justin Jautard
IVB
Waffen-Obersturmführer Pierre Marie Métais
Staff Company
Waffen-Hauptsturmführer Marc Raoul de Perricot

9ª Company
Waffen-Obersturmführer Jean Français
10ª Company
Waffen-Oberscharführer ? Girard

I Battalion
Kdr.:
Waffen-Hauptsturmführer Emile Monneuse
Adjutant
Waffen-Obersturmführer Alfred Falcy
IVB
Waffen-Obersturmführer ? Thibaud
1ª Company
Waffen-Obersturmführer Jean Fatin
2ª Company
Waffen-Obersturmführer Jean Baptiste Geronimi
3ª Company
Waffen-Untersturmführer Yves Rigeade
4ª Company
Waffen-Obersturmführer André Tardan

II Battalion
Kdr.:
Waffen-Hauptsturmführer Maurice Berret
Adjutant
Waffen-Untersturmführer Michel de Genouillac
IVB
Waffen-Obersturmführer Philippe Joubert
5ª Company
Waffen-Obersturmführer Georges Wagner
6ª Company
Waffen-Obersturmführer Michel Saint-Magne
7ª Company
Waffen-Hauptscharführer ? Walter
8ª Company
Waffen-Obersturmführer Paul Defever

PANZERJÄGER BATTALION DER SS 33
Kdr.:
Waffen-Sturmbannführer Jean Boudet-Gheusi
Adjutant
Waffen-Standartenoberjunker Georges Radici
IVA
Waffen-Obersturmführer ? Weiss
IVB
Waffen-Obersturmführer ? Durandy
Flak Company
Waffen-Untersturmführer René Fayard
Pak Company
Waffen-Obersturmführer Serge Krotoff
Assault Gun Company
Waffen-Obersturmführer Pierre Michel

ARTILLERIE ABTEILUNG DER SS 33
Kdr.:
Waffen-Hauptsturmführer Jean Havette
Adjutant
Waffen-Hauptsturmführer Jacques Martin
IVB
Waffen-Obersturmführer René Fraysse
1ª Battery
Waffen-Obersturmführer ? Chaufour
2ª Battery
Waffen-Obersturmführer Louis Salle
3ª Battery
Waffen-Standartenoberjunker Henri Le Guichaoua

Greetings
Juanjo

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Re: 33.Waffen-Grenadier-Division der SS "Charlemange"

Post by Phil Don » 02 Mar 2008 00:42

Hi

There's not very much things to add.

For me, the IVc of the staff (Hstuf Jean RICHERT) and the Kdr of the Veterinär Kp (Ustuf Jean RICHTER) are the same. Hstuf Jean RICHERT right.

First commander of the Rgt 57: Ostubaf Paul GAMORY-DUBOURDEAU them Victor de BOURMONT (name complete Victor de GHAISNE de BOURMONT).
5ª Company : Waffen-Oberscharführer ? Hennecart first name Lucien

First commander of the Rgt 58: Stubaf Jean BRIDOUX then Emile RAYBAUD (not Emilie who is a woman first name)
7ª Company: Waffen-Hauptscharführer ? Walter first name Eric

Regards

Phil

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Re: 33.Waffen-Grenadier-Division der SS "Charlemange"

Post by Endzeit Jan » 02 Mar 2008 08:47

Hi Phil
its fantastic Work, its great

7ª Company: Waffen-Hauptscharführer ? Walter first name Eric
I have SS-Ostuf.Wagner of 7.Kp, 5.Kp. is by me Walter

Where do I find the filling of vacancies (Stellenbesetzung) of the Staff 15.SS-Div.?
Jan

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Re: 33.Waffen-Grenadier-Division der SS "Charlemange"

Post by Phil Don » 02 Mar 2008 12:33

Hi Jan

For the staff of the latvian 15 SS Div., I think that on the topic "Let's buit the Latvian Legion" at the top of the forum is the right place. Our friend VJK have surely infos. This is what I have :

Phil.

I delete the 15 SS division's staff because it is more at his place in the topic Let's built the Latvian Legion and I post it on.
Phil.
Last edited by Phil Don on 03 Mar 2008 23:15, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 33.Waffen-Grenadier-Division der SS "Charlemange"

Post by Endzeit Jan » 02 Mar 2008 13:38

Thanks

Construction Company-- Waffen-Obersturmführer ? de Moroge
it is Bau-Kp.(in german)


Verbindungsoff.: 10.02.1945-00.03.1945 SS-Ostuf.Kurt Dally

Verbindungsoff.: 00.03.1945-00.05.1945 SS-Ustuf.Heinz Gering

Verbindungsoff.: 00.00.1945-00.00.1945 SS-Stubaf.Dr.Löhöffel

Verbindungsoff.: 00.00.1945-00.00.1945 SS-Stubaf.Roemheld

for waht Verbinungsoffizier????

Jan

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Re: 33.Waff.Gren.Div.der SS "Charlemange"(franz.Nr.1)

Post by Malbret17 » 03 Mar 2008 14:20

Hello Juanjo

Good work (from Forbès book ?)
I Batallion
Kdr Waffen - Hauptsturmführer Emile MONEUSE with a "N" only and not MONNEUSE.

Regards

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