SS-Obersturmbannführer Josef "Sepp" Syr

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L. Sikora
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SS-Obersturmbannführer Josef "Sepp" Syr

Post by L. Sikora » 13 Jan 2009 18:01

Hello,

I looking Infos and photos from SS-Obersturmbannführer Josef Syr

My knowladge:

Born: 18.10.1908
Died: ?

SS-Nr:283029

SS-Sturmbannführer 21.06.1942
SS-Obersturmbannführer: 30.01.1945.

Carrier:

11.11.1942 - 15.12.1942 Kdr. SS-Ski Btl. (SS-Kav. div.)
??.??. 1943 - ??.07.1944 Kdr. 14. SS-Aufkl.Abt. (14. Freiwilligen-Inf.div.)
??.?? 1944 - 24.06.1944 Kdr. 23. SS-Aufkl.Abt. ( 23. "Kama" Waffen-Geb.div.)
??.??1944 - ??.??.???? Kdr. 13. Aufkl.Abt. (13. "Handschar" Waffen-Geb.div.)
01.10.1944 - (01.03.1945) Kdr. 79. SS-Freiwilligen-Gren.Rgt (31. SS-Freiw.Gren.div.)

Thanks a lot

Regards
Laszlo

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Re: Obersturmbannführer Josef "Sepp" Syr

Post by Jan-Hendrik » 13 Jan 2009 19:21

Thread on Syr in the SS research section :wink:

Jan-Hendrik

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Re: Obersturmbannführer Josef "Sepp" Syr

Post by L. Sikora » 13 Jan 2009 21:34

Dear Jan-Hendrik

Thanks a lot!!

Laszlo

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Re: Obersturmbannführer Josef "Sepp" Syr

Post by Giorgio » 14 Jan 2009 22:11

Hallo Laszlo,
This is what I've in my file:
Born: 18 October 1903 in Volkenstrauss.
Died: 12 July 1977 in Augsburg.
NSDAP-N°: ? (Joined on ?)
SS-N°: 283.029.

Promotions
SS-Untersturmführer: 01 July 1937.
SS-Obersturmführer: 25 July 1938.
SS-Hauptsturmführer der Waffen-SS: 01 August 1941.
SS-Sturmbannführer der Waffen-SS: 21 June 1942.
SS-Obersturmbannführer der Waffen-SS: 30 January 1945.

Assignments
Oberfeldwebel des Heeres & Instructor in the Hauptreitschule München: from 1937 to ?
SS-Untersturmführer assigned to the SS-FHA: 22 July 1937.
SS-Obersturmführer (SS-Hauptreitschule München): 25 July 1938.
SS-Hauptsturmführer serving in 1.Kompanie/SS-Aufklärungs-Abteilung 1: April 1942.
Syr was the military commander of the Sonderkommando Künsberg of the Foreign Office (Auswärtigen Amtes "AA"). For a period of time in 1942 Syr merged his force with that of the SS-Aufklärungs-Abteilung 1/LSSAH. The entry for 21 June 1942 in Dienstlaufbahn would appear to confirm his official membership in the LSSAH at the time.
SS-Sturmbannführer & Commander of SS-Radfahr-Aufklärungs-Abteilung (Cycling Reconnaissance Unit)/SS-Kavallerie-Division: 01 October 1942-?
http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... 8&t=136142

According to Mehner, Syr was SS-Sturmbannführer & Commander of the SS-Ski-Battalion/SS-Radfahr-Aufklärungs-Abteilung/SS-Kavallerie-Division: 11 November-15 December 1942, and
SS-Sturmbannführer & (deputy ?) Commander of SS-Kavallerie-Regiment 3 (17)/SS-Kavallerie-Division: December 1942 or 21 January 1943–WIA 04 February 1943.
http://www.frontkjemper.info/show_reg.p ... mentsID=17
http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=42257
http://frontkjemper.info/show_person.php?P_ID=923

Hospitalized ?

SS-Sturmbannführer & Commander of SS-Kavallerie-Regiment 3.(17)/SS-Kavallerie-Ausbildungs-und-Ersatz-Regiment (former SS-Kavallerie-Ersatz-Abteilung Warschau): from 21 January 1943.
SS-Sturmbannführer & Commander of SS-Kavallerie-Regiment 3/SS-Kavallerie-Division: 01 May 1943 to January 1944 or. Succeeded by Adolf Schwarzmaier.
http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=42257
SS-Sturmbannführer & Commander ? Bataillon /15.Waffen-Grenadier-Division der SS (Lettische Nr 1): 01 January 1944 - until ?
SS-Sturmbannführer & Commander of Fusilier Bataillon14 /14.Galizische SS-Freiwilligen-Infanterie-Division: 10 or 15 March-16 June 1944.
http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=45302
http://www.dws-xip.com/reich/waffen/14adgren.html
http://www.frontkjemper.info/show_person.php?P_ID=923

SS-Sturmbannführer & Commander of Gebirgs-Aufklärungs-Abteilung 23 (SS-Freiwilligen-Gebirgsjäger-Regiment 56)/23.Waffen-Gebirgs-Division der SS “Kama” (Kroatische Nr. 2): 10-19 June 1944.
http://forum.panzer-archiv.de/viewtopic ... 685#143685
http://frontkjemper.info/show_person.php?P_ID=923

SS-Sturmbannführer & Commander of SS-Waffen-Gebirgsjäger-Regiment 27/13.Waffen-Gebirgs-Division der SS “Handschar” (Kroatische Nr. 1): 19 June-18 August 1944.
http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=42257
http://frontkjemper.info/show_person.php?P_ID=923
http://www.sweb.cz/freiwilligen/DOBROVOLNICI/m21.htm

SS-Obersturmbannführer & Commander of the SS-Freiwilligen-Grenadier-Regiment 79/31.SS-Freiwilligen-Grenadier-Division “Batschka”: 01 October 1944 or 30 January-February 1945.
http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=42257
http://www.frontkjemper.info/show_person.php?P_ID=923

Decorations & Awards
1939 Iron Cross Second Class.
1939 Iron Cross First Class.
Ehrendegen des RFSS.
Totenkopfring der SS.
SA-Sportabzeichen.

Pena V
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Re: Obersturmbannführer Josef "Sepp" Syr

Post by Pena V » 15 Jan 2009 00:44

Great work once again Giorgio! However one thing bothers me. If Syr was the CO of SS-Kavallerie-Regiment 3 01 May 1943 - ?? Jan 1944 then what did August Zehender do during that time? In my files Zehender was the CO of SS-Kavallerie-Regiment 3 (and later 17) 30 Mar 1943 - 20 Feb 1944.

Regards,

Pena

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Re: Obersturmbannführer Josef "Sepp" Syr

Post by Mark C. Yerger » 15 Jan 2009 02:57

The overly complicated changes in the commanders of the Kavallerie Regimenter will be explained in detail with the new vol. 4 of my German Cross in Gold Holders of the SS and Police series, at the printer now. None of the previous cavalry books included the correct situations, commanders, and all the rather complex command changes. Easier for me to wait for the book than try to explain all the points and research. Syr had a career that went from smaller to larger commands and then back again to smaller units.

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Re: Obersturmbannführer Josef "Sepp" Syr

Post by Jan-Hendrik » 15 Jan 2009 07:04

31.SS-Frw.Gren.Div. had not 'name'.

And for 22.Frw.Kav.Div. my doubts are increasing that it had no name, too...

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Re: Obersturmbannführer Josef "Sepp" Syr

Post by Giorgio » 15 Jan 2009 16:50

Dear Jan-Hendrik,
And for 22.Frw.Kav.Div. my doubts are increasing that it had no name, too...
In the Italian language version of Robin Lumsden's book "Himmler's Black Order. A History of the SS, 1923-45" (the 22te SS-Freiwilligen-Kavallerie-Division is named "Maria Theresa", as well as in the Italian language version of Gordon Williamson's book "The SS: Hitler's Instruments of Terror". The latter adds the former name "Ungarn" for MT.
Also Marc Yerger, in "Riding East" page 209 wrote, 'SS-Kavallerie-Regiment 3 was later detached and eventually used to form the SS-Kavallerie-Division Maria Theresia in 1944'.
Why are your doubts increasing?

Dear Pena V
However one thing bothers me. If Syr was the CO of SS-Kavallerie-Regiment 3 01 May 1943 - ?? Jan 1944 then what did August Zehender do during that time? In my files Zehender was the CO of SS-Kavallerie-Regiment 3 (and later 17) 30 Mar 1943 - 20 Feb 1944.
While i'm waiting for Mark's new fourth book (I already got I° & 2° volume and I found them very, very useful), this is what I've in my file on August Zehender :
SS-Obersturmbannführer & Commander of SS-Kavallerie-Regiment 2/SS-Kavallerie-Division: 15 April or June 1942-October 1943; regiment renumbered 16 after 8.SS-Kavallerie-division formed October 22, 1943).
SS-Standartenführer & Commander SS-Kavallerie-Regiment 16/8.SS-Kavallerie-Division: October 1943- late (20 ?) April 1944. Division' s final redesignation as “Florian Geyer” on March 12, 1944.

Two sources
"Ende Juni 1941 wurde Zehender an der Ostfront bei Losza schwer verwundet und übernahm nach seiner Genesung das SS-Reiterregiment 2 und war bis 1944 bei allen schweren Einsätzen der SS-Kavallerie-Brigade (der späteren 8.SS-Kavallerie-Division "Florian Geyer") dabei".
http://www.ritterkreuztraeger-1939-45.d ... August.htm

"(Zehender) led the Battle Group named after him until its personnel were incorporated into the SS-Kavallerie-Division after withdrawal from the front in late June, 1942. Zehender then commanded SS-Kavallerie-Regiment 2 until February 1944 when he was placed in reserve'.
Source: "Riding East", page 190.
Cheers,
Giorgio

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Re: Obersturmbannführer Josef "Sepp" Syr

Post by Jan-Hendrik » 15 Jan 2009 16:57

In the Italian language version of Robin Lumsden's book "Himmler's Black Order. A History of the SS, 1923-45" (the 22te SS-Freiwilligen-Kavallerie-Division is named "Maria Theresa", as well as in the Italian language version of Gordon Williamson's book "The SS: Hitler's Instruments of Terror". The latter adds the former name "Ungarn" for MT.
Also Marc Yerger, in "Riding East" page 209 wrote, 'SS-Kavallerie-Regiment 3 was later detached and eventually used to form the SS-Kavallerie-Division Maria Theresia in 1944'.
Why are your doubts increasing?
- Trang states that the Division received the name in end of 1944, but without giving a date or a source for that

- Hanns Bayer tells about the raising of a 22.Frw.Kav.Div., later talking about "Maria Theresia", but without giving a clue why

- Georg Tessin clearly wrote that he often heart the Division was called so, but that in all documents he sighted only the term "22.Frw.Kav.Div." was used.

- myself has not found any official document using the name

- yesterday I phoned a friend to dig through his SS-FHA files to look if the find one single document using the name...are you surprised that he found ---NONE? :cry:

By the way:
Gordon Williamson's book "The SS: Hitler's Instruments of Terror"
In my opinion one of those books you can drop into the waste bin without bothering :D

Jan-Hendrik

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Re: Obersturmbannführer Josef "Sepp" Syr

Post by Giorgio » 15 Jan 2009 21:09

Hello Jan-Hendrik,
Thank you. I understand and acknowledge that I'm still a beginner, a novice, although I'm interested in the history of the SS for more than seven years. And I'll take note of your opinion on the book of Williamson, although it was one of the first books to raise my interest.
Giorgio

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Re: Obersturmbannführer Josef "Sepp" Syr

Post by Pena V » 15 Jan 2009 22:47

This is really interesting. I knew in advance that it is also complicated. When one question is answered another one pops up. Now that we have Zehender commanding SS-Kavallerie-Regiment 2 (16) from 15 Apr/Jun 1942 to 01(?) Jan 1944 I wonder what did Waldemar Fegelein do 01 Apr 1943 - 16 Dec 1943 as I had him commanding SS-Kavallerie-Regiment 2 (16) at that time?

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Re: Obersturmbannführer Josef "Sepp" Syr

Post by Phil Nix » 16 Jan 2009 12:58

I have Fegelein as Kdr Kav Reg 2 12.6.43 - 1.4.44 and Zehrender as Kdr 1.6.42 - 12.6.43. prior to 12.6.43 I havd Fegelein as attached to SSFHA.
Phil Nix

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Re: Obersturmbannführer Josef "Sepp" Syr

Post by Pena V » 18 Jan 2009 01:49

Now the question is who was the CO of SS-Kavallerie-Regiment 2 (16) from 12 Jun 1943 to the beginning of 1944. Waldemar Fegelein or August Zehender?

Pena

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Re: SS-Obersturmbannführer Josef "Sepp" Syr

Post by Mikedc » 01 Aug 2012 21:58

Hello Giorgio,
Here's a document, posted by John Moore, which more or less tells us that he became CO from SS-Kavallerie-Regiment 3 on 1.10.1942
http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... &start=360 (Sept-1943---2.jpg)

And when you look back earlier in this thread Jan-Hendrik has posted a link to another thread about Syr on this forum. In that thread John has posted a lot more info about Syr, amongst others a document with Syr's promo-dates and his assignments. Regarding the promodates, I can't read the first one, maybe you can.

Greetings, Mike

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Re: SS-Obersturmbannführer Josef "Sepp" Syr

Post by Jan-Hendrik » 22 Jan 2016 13:43

*push*

Jan-Hendrik

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