Nickiel deposits in Petsamo area

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masqqqq
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Nickiel deposits in Petsamo area

Post by masqqqq » 22 Nov 2010 13:09

I'm looking for information about nickiel deposits at Petsamo. What was output of nickiel ( per pure nickiel) in the years 1940-44 separatly. Especially at 43 and 44.
Aditonally what was strenght of AA defence that area.

JariL
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Re: Nickiel deposits in Petsamo area

Post by JariL » 22 Nov 2010 15:49

Hi,

Without having the exakt numbers, the following can nevertheless be stated. Before 1943 the production of the mine was running very low (10.000 tons of ore?). In order to get things going minister Speer spent a month in Lapland in 1943. After his visit the production increased to a level (300.000 tons of ore) that filled the German reserves with nickel so that it would have lasted until 1946 with the peak production of the latter half of 1944.

Kolosjoki mine and especially the power plant in Jäniskoski that supplied it with electricity were the best protected places in Finland against air raids. Germasn were responsible for their protection. Germans for example cast a concrete roof over the hydro power plant to protect it against bombs. Again I do not have the number of guns at hand but I remember reading that it was about the same as in Helsinki i.e. ca. 70 heavy and 30 light AA guns.

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Harri
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Re: Nickiel deposits in Petsamo area

Post by Harri » 23 Nov 2010 17:17

This information is from the Finnish sources:
In the summer 1943 13. Flak-Brigade (mot.) had a total of 42 heavy / mixed and 25 light AA batteries. In August 1944 brigade had 85% of its guns (68x 88 mm, 44x 37 mm and 116x 20 mm) at Kolosjoki - Petsamo region. In total Flak-Regiment 142 (v) [= Flakgruppe Kolosjoki, 1.11.43- Flakgruppe Lappland] had 18 AA batteries, Flak-Regiment 181 (mot.) [= Flakgruppe Finnland] 44 batteries and Flak-Regiment 229 (mot.) [= Flakgruppe Eismeer] 42 of which 14 were heavy.

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masqqqq
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Re: Nickiel deposits in Petsamo area

Post by masqqqq » 23 Nov 2010 19:58

Wow very strong defence!!!!.

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Re: Nickiel deposits in Petsamo area

Post by John T » 26 Nov 2010 22:55

JariL wrote:Hi,

Without having the exakt numbers, the following can nevertheless be stated. Before 1943 the production of the mine was running very low (10.000 tons of ore?). In order to get things going minister Speer spent a month in Lapland in 1943. After his visit the production increased to a level (300.000 tons of ore) that filled the German reserves with nickel so that it would have lasted until 1946 with the peak production of the latter half of 1944.
That s correct but Finland mined nickel in Hitara (Nivala) from 1941 too.

If someone care for details, look at http://en.gtk.fi/ExplorationFinland/Commodities/Nickel/
(but data for deposits within Finlands current borders)

the following table is from Finland, Germany, and the Soviet Union, 1940-1941; the Petsamo dispute, by H. Peter Krosby

Cheers
/John
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Re: Nickiel deposits in Petsamo area

Post by Simon Orchard » 27 Nov 2010 10:52

Harri wrote:This information is from the Finnish sources:
In the summer 1943 13. Flak-Brigade (mot.) had a total of 42 heavy / mixed and 25 light AA batteries. In August 1944 brigade had 85% of its guns (68x 88 mm, 44x 37 mm and 116x 20 mm) at Kolosjoki - Petsamo region. In total Flak-Regiment 142 (v) [= Flakgruppe Kolosjoki, 1.11.43- Flakgruppe Lappland] had 18 AA batteries, Flak-Regiment 181 (mot.) [= Flakgruppe Finnland] 44 batteries and Flak-Regiment 229 (mot.) [= Flakgruppe Eismeer] 42 of which 14 were heavy.

This included defence of Kirkenes, Petsamo, Liinahamari as well as the airfields such as Høybuktmoen outside Kirkenes.

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Re: Nickiel deposits in Petsamo area

Post by masqqqq » 27 Nov 2010 21:34

Exelent data. It will be good to recalculate nickiel matte as pure metal ( 70% ?). More world statistics are presented as pure metal content.
Additionaly I have second question: was mining copper together with nickiel ? And in what quantity.

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Re: Nickiel deposits in Petsamo area

Post by Jagala » 29 Nov 2010 11:41

Germany recived (i.e. shipping losses excluded) roughly 13.000 tons as pure nickel, not such a huge share of wartime consumption of 50.000 tons, but in 1943 it accounted for 73% and in 1944 (up to September) for 87%. (However, the new plant in Frankenstein would have diminished it down to 50%.)

Production in Petsamo was somewhat larger; some went for domestic consumption and some was exported to Sweden.

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Re: Nickiel deposits in Petsamo area

Post by Harri » 29 Nov 2010 20:30

masqqqq wrote:Additionaly I have second question: was mining copper together with nickiel ? And in what quantity.
The refined so called "Matte" contained about 50% of nickel. Usually there are also other metals with nickel, like copper. At Kolosjoki there was copper too but I don't know the actual percentage. Before the war it was estimated that there would be about 1.6% of copper and 1.3% of nickel. The actual nickel concentration proved to be much higher: 3.9%.

During the war there was a nickel and copper mine also at Makola, Nivala. It was opened in 1941 but its production was rather small compared to Kolosjoki. The biggest copper mine in Finland was at Outokumpu and there was another also at Ylöjärvi, near Tampere. Outokumpu's "concentrated copper ore" contained 4% copper, 28% iron, 25% sulphur, 1% zink, 0,20% cobolt and additionally 0,80 grams of gold and 9 grams of silver per tons of ore.

Nickel was so important to Germany because in 1939 it's domestic production was only 5% of its need.

This is the Finnish Wikipedia page of Kolosjoki nickel mines. In the map Finnish Kolosjoki has a Russian name Nikel:
http://fi.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kolosjoen_kaivos

In the summer 1939 there were already 1.400 workers at Kolosjoki although mostly builders, for example American bricklayers.

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Re: Nickiel deposits in Petsamo area

Post by Jagala » 01 Dec 2010 11:38

John T wrote:Finland mined nickel in Hitara (Nivala) from 1941 too
The mine in Hitara was opened after the war. The annual production in Makola was about 500 tons of nickel, all of which was exported to Germany in 1941 and 1942, but after that the whole quota for Germany was produced in Kolosjoki.

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Re: Nickiel deposits in Petsamo area

Post by Jagala » 01 Dec 2010 11:44

masqqqq wrote:Additionaly I have second question: was mining copper together with nickiel ? And in what quantity.
The copper content of the ore from Kolosjoki shipped to Germany amounted to 5.000 tons of pure copper per year. (This was in addition to the agreed annual quota of 12.000 tons from the Outokumpu mine.)

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Re: Nickiel deposits in Petsamo area

Post by John T » 17 Mar 2011 21:27

Jagala wrote:
John T wrote:Finland mined nickel in Hitara (Nivala) from 1941 too
The mine in Hitara was opened after the war. The annual production in Makola was about 500 tons of nickel, all of which was exported to Germany in 1941 and 1942, but after that the whole quota for Germany was produced in Kolosjoki.
Yes, I mixed up the two mines in Nivala.
Best Regards
/John

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Re: Nickiel deposits in Petsamo area

Post by Seppo Jyrkinen » 18 Mar 2011 16:39

Petsamo's importance comes out also when examining the strength of Germans in Northern Finland.

In the beginning of Barbarossa there was roughly 70.000 German soldiers in Finland, but 1944 amount was 214.000.

Ironically those troops didn't actually fight after autumn 1941 but were having something like garrison service. And same time German army's south front needed more men, west front also - and east front was yelling more men.
A word irony is baked into the word history.

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Re: Nickiel deposits in Petsamo area

Post by Juha Tompuri » 18 Mar 2011 20:33

Seppo Jyrkinen wrote:Ironically those troops didn't actually fight after autumn 1941 but were having something like garrison service. And same time German army's south front needed more men, west front also - and east front was yelling more men.
Yes, Petsamo nickel was in a way wasted resources for the Germans.
The nickel from there was important to Germany, but not totally vital like the Swedish iron ore had been.

Regards, Juha

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Re: Nickiel deposits in Petsamo area

Post by Seppo Jyrkinen » 19 Mar 2011 09:33

Juha Tompuri wrote:The nickel from there was important to Germany, but not totally vital like the Swedish iron ore had been.
Regards, Juha
I quite won't agree with you. Nickel in used to produce top-quality steel which you need to produce industry tools, engines and arms. Nickel is like a spice in a good food.
A word irony is baked into the word history.

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