Crusader OOB

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jurisnik
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Crusader OOB

Post by jurisnik » 20 Aug 2011 18:34

Hi all,

I'm looking for detailed OOB (with vehicle, guns, tank types and quantities) for axis and allied sides for Operation Crusader.

I've found some data (in existing topic: http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... 6&t=128748) and other sources, so I've started building OOB. It still lacks data to be complete and to be used in my new game.

I'll be thankful if anybody can help me finish it or find missing data.

And here's what I have so far:

Operation Crusader - AXIS land OOB

Panzergruppe Afrika

-- Army troops
---- Artilleriekommandeur 104.
II./115. schwere Artillerie Abteilung (mot.) – 9 x 210mm M18 How.
* 4./115. schwere Artillerie Abteilung (mot.) – 3 x 210mm M18 How.
* 5./115. schwere Artillerie Abteilung (mot.) – 3 x 210mm M18 How.
* 6./115. schwere Artillerie Abteilung (mot.) – 3 x 210mm M18 How.
408. schwere Artillerie Abteilung (mot.) – 12 x 105mm K18 Gun
* 1./408. schwere Artillerie Abteilung (mot.) – 4 x 105mm K18 Gun
* 2./408. schwere Artillerie Abteilung (mot.) – 4 x 105mm K18 Gun
* 3./408. schwere Artillerie Abteilung (mot.) – 4 x 105mm K18 Gun
902. schwere Artillerie Batterie (mot.) – 3 x 170mm K. in Mörser Lafette
4./149. Artillerie Regiment – 3 x 170mm FK18 Gun (not yet arrived)
4./172. Artillerie Regiment – 3 x 170mm FK18 Gun (not yet arrived)
363. Gebirgs Artillerie Batterie – 3 x 75mm leGb How.
364. Gebirgs Artillerie Batterie – 3 x 75mm leGb How.
523. Heeres Kusten Artillerie Abteilung
* 1./523. Heeres Kusten Artillerie Abteilung – 6 x 155mm sK 418(f)
* 2./523. Heeres Kusten Artillerie Abteilung – 6 x 155mm sK 418(f)
* 3./523. Heeres Kusten Artillerie Abteilung – 6 x 155mm sK 418(f)
528. Heeres Kusten Artillerie Abteilung
* 1./528. Heeres Kusten Artillerie Abteilung – 6 x 155mm sK 418(f) (not yet arrived)
* 2./528. Heeres Kusten Artillerie Abteilung – 6 x 155mm sK 418(f)
* 3./528. Heeres Kusten Artillerie Abteilung – 6 x 155mm sK 418(f)
529. Heeres Kusten Artillerie Abteilung
* 1./529. Heeres Kusten Artillerie Abteilung – 6 x 155mm sFH414[f] How. (not yet arrived)
* 2./529. Heeres Kusten Artillerie Abteilung – 6 x 155mm sFH414[f] How. (not yet arrived)
* 3./529. Heeres Kusten Artillerie Abteilung – 6 x 155mm sFH414[f] How. (not yet arrived)
533. Heeres Kusten Artillerie Abteilung
* 1./533. Heeres Kusten Artillerie Abteilung – 6 x 155mm sFH414[f] How.
* 2./533. Heeres Kusten Artillerie Abteilung – 6 x 155mm sFH414[f] How.
* 3./533. Heeres Kusten Artillerie Abteilung – 6 x 155mm sFH414[f] How.




Corpo d' Armata di' Manovra XX

-- Divisione Corazzata 132. 'Ariete'
---- Reggimento Corazzato 132.
Battaglione Carri 7. - 53 x M13/40-41
Battaglione Carri 8. - 53 x M13/40-41
Battaglione Carri 9. - 53 x M13/40-41
---- Reggimento Bersaglieri 8.
Battaglione Bersaglieri d’accompagnamento 3. (HW) - 1 x Compagnie Controaerea, 1 x Compagnie Mitraglieri,1 x Compagnie Mortai
Battaglione Bersaglieri 5. – 2 x Compagnie Bersaglieri, 1 x Compagnie Controcarri
Battaglione Bersaglieri 12. – 2 x Compagnie Bersaglieri, 1 x Compagnie Controcarri
---- Reggimento Artiglieria 132. (motorized)
Battaglione Artiglieria 1./132. – 12 x 75/27mm Gun
Battaglione Artiglieria 2./132. – 12 x 75/27mm Gun
Battaglione Artiglieria 3./132. – 10 x 105/28mm How.
Battaglione Semovente 551. – 8 x Semovente 75/18 (+ 2 unarmed Command Semovente)
Battaglione Semovente 552. –8 x Semovente 75/18 (+ 2 unarmed Command Semovente)
Battaglione Controaerea 4./132. – 10 x 90mm AA Autocannoni
Battaglione Controaerea 2., Reggimento Artiglieria 24. – 8 x 88mm Flak
---- Division Troops
Battaglione Carri 3., Reggimento "Lancieri di Novara" (2 Co.) – 33 x L6/40
Battaglione Autoblinda 3., Reggimento "Nizza Cavalleria" (2 Co.) – 40 x AB41
Battaglione Genio Misto 32.



-- Divisione Motorizzata 101. 'Trieste'
---- Reggimento Motorizzato 65.
Battaglione Motorizzato 1./65. – 3 x Compagnie Fucilieri
Battaglione Motorizzato 2./65. – 3 x Compagnie Fucilieri
---- Reggimento Motorizzato 66.
Battaglione Motorizzato 1./66. – 3 x Compagnie Fucilieri
Battaglione Motorizzato 2./66. – 3 x Compagnie Fucilieri
---- Reggimento Bersaglieri 9.
Battaglione Autoblinda Bersaglieri 8. (2 Co.)
---- Reggimento Artiglieria 21. (motorized)
Battaglione Artiglieria 1./21. – 10 x 75/27mm Gun
Battaglione Artiglieria 2./21. – 10 x 75/27mm Gun
Battaglione Artiglieria 3./21. – 12 x 100/17mm How.
Battaglione Artiglieria 4./21. - 12 x 100/17mm How.
Battaglione Controaerea 5./21. – 12 x 75mm Flak
Compagnie Controaerea 146. – 8 x 20mm AA
Compagnie Controaerea 411. – 8 x 20mm AA
---- Division Troops
Battaglione Carri 11. – 53 x M13/40-41
Battaglione Genio Misto 52. (motorized)





Deutsches Afrika Korps

-- Corps Troops
---- 612. Heer Fla Abt.
1./612. Heer Fla Abt. – 12 x SdKfz 10/4
2./612. Heer Fla Abt. – 12 x SdKfz 10/4
---- 606. Heer Fla Abt.
1./606. Heer Flak Abteilung - 10 x SdKfz 10/4, 2 x SdKfz 7/1
3./606. Heer Flak Abteilung - 10 x SdKfz 10/4, 2 x SdKfz 7/1
---- 33. Luftwaffe Flak Regiment
1./33. Luftwaffe Flak Regiment - 4 x 88mm Flak
2./33. Luftwaffe Flak Regiment - 4 x 88mm Flak
3./33. Luftwaffe Flak Regiment - 4 x 88mm Flak
4./33. Luftwaffe Flak Regiment - 12 x 20mm Flak
5./33. Luftwaffe Flak Regiment - 12 x 20mm Flak



-- 15. Panzer Division
---- 8. Panzer Regiment - 42 Pz II, 77 Pz III, 21 Pz IV
I. Panzer Abteilung - 21 Pz II, 38 Pz III, 10 Pz IV
II. Panzer Abteilung - 21 Pz II, 39 Pz III, 11 Pz IV
---- 115. Schutzen Regiment
I. Schutzen Bataillon – 4 x Schutzen Kompanien
II. Schutzen Bataillon – 4 x Schutzen Kompanien
III. Schutzen Bataillon – 4 x Schutzen Kompanien
115. Infanteriegsch. Kompanie (1 x Infanteriegeschutz Kompanie – 4 x 75mm leIG, 2 x 150mm sIG)
1 x Pionier Kompanie
---- 33. Artillerie Regiment
I. leichte Abteilung – 12 x 105mm FH18 How.
II. leichte Abteilung – 12 x 105mm FH18 How.
III. schwere Abteilung – 4 x 105mm FK18 Gun, 8 x 150mm sFH18 How.
---- Division Troops
33. Panzeraufklarungs Abteilung – 1 x Pzspah Kp., 1 x Krad. Kp., 1 x schwere Kp.
1./33. Panzerjager Abteilung (mot.) (1 Kp.) – 9 x 50mm Pak
2./33. Panzerjager Abteilung (mot.) 1 Kp.) – 9 x 50mm Pak
1./43. Luftwaffe Flak Regiment (mot.) (attached) – 9 x 88mm Flak
2./43. Luftwaffe Flak Regiment (mot.) (attached) – 9 x 88mm Flak
3./43. Luftwaffe Flak Regiment (mot.) (attached) – 12 x 20mm Flak
4./43. Luftwaffe Flak Regiment (mot.) (attached) – 12 x 20mm Flak
33. Pionier Bataillon (mot.) - 3 Kp.



-- 21. Panzer Division
---- 5. Panzer Regiment - 35 Pz II, 68 Pz III, 17 Pz IV
I. Panzer Abteilung - 17 Pz II, 34 Pz III, 8 Pz IV
II. Panzer Abteilung - 18 Pz II, 34 Pz III, 9 Pz IV
---- 104. Schutzen Regiment
I. Schutzen Bataillon – 4 x Schutzen Kompanien
II. Schutzen Bataillon – 4 x Schutzen Kompanien
III. Schutzen Bataillon – 4 x Schutzen Kompanien
104. Infanteriegsch. Kompanie (1 x Infanteriegeschutz Kompanie – 4 x 75mm leIG, 2 x 150mm sIG)
1 x Pionier Kompanie
---- 155. Artillerie Regiment
I. leichte Abteilung - 12 x 105mm FH18 How.
II. leichte Abteilung - 12 x 105mm FH18 How.
III. schwere Abteilung - 105mm FK18 Gun, 8 x 150mm sFH18 How.
---- Division Troops
3. Panzeraufklarungs Abteilung (-) (see KG “Kiehl”) – 1 x Pzspah Kp., 1 x Krad. Kp., 1 x schwere Kp.+ 6 x 25# Field Gun
1./39. Panzerjager Abteilung (mot.) (1 Kp.) – 9 x 50mm Pak
2./39. Panzerjager Abteilung (mot.) (-) (1 Kp. - see KG “Kiehl”) – 6 x 50mm Pak
200. Pionier Bataillon (mot.) (3 Kp.)
1./18. Luftwaffe Flak Regiment (mot.) (attached) - 4 x 88mm Flak
2./18. Luftwaffe Flak Regiment (mot.) (attached) - 4 x 88mm Flak
3./18. Luftwaffe Flak Regiment (mot.) (attached) - 4 x 88mm Flak
4./18. Luftwaffe Flak Regiment (mot.) (attached) - 12 x 20mm Flak
5./18. Luftwaffe Flak Regiment (mot.) (attached) - 12 x 20mm Flak



-- Division-Kommando z.b. V. Afrika
---- 155. Schutzen Regiment
I. Schutzen Bataillon - 4 Kp.
II. Schutzen Bataillon - 4 Kp.
III. Schutzen Bataillon - 4 Kp.
---- 361. Afrika Regiment
I. Schutzen Bataillon - 4 Kp.
II. Schutzen Bataillon - 4 Kp.
---- Division Troops
3./255. Schutzen Regiment - 4 Kp.
3./347. Schutzen Regiment - 4 Kp.
Oasen Bataillon z.b.V. 300 - 5 Kp.
361. Artillerie Abteilung (mot.) – 8 x 75 mm leGb
1./605. Panzerjager Abteilung (sfl.) – 9 x Panzerjager Ib
2./605. Panzerjager Abteilung (sfl.) – 9 x Panzerjager Ib
3./605. Panzerjager Abteilung (sfl.) – 9 x Panzerjager Ib
900. Pionier Bataillon (mot.) (2 Kp.)



-- Divisione Fanteria 55. 'Savona' (mot.)
---- Reggimento Fanteria 15.
UNKNOWN ???

---- Reggimento Fanteria 16.
UNKNOWN ???

---- Reggimento Artiglieria 12.
UNKNOWN ???





Corpo d' Armata XXI

-- Divisione Fanteria 17. 'Pavia' (mot.)
---- Reggimento Fanteria 27. (AS42)
Battaglione Fanteria 1./27. – 4 x Compagnie Fucilieri
Battaglione Fanteria 2./27. – 4 x Compagnie Fucilieri
Battaglione Fanteria 3./27. – 4 x Compagnie Fucilieri
---- Reggimento Fanteria 28. (AS42)
Battaglione Fanteria 1./28. – 4 x Compagnie Fucilieri
Battaglione Fanteria 2./28. – 4 x Compagnie Fucilieri
Battaglione Fanteria 3./28. – 4 x Compagnie Fucilieri
---- Reggimento Artiglieria 26. (motorized)
Battaglione Artiglieria 1./26.- 12 x 105/28mm Gun
Battaglione Artiglieria 2./26. - 12 x 105/28mm Gun
Battaglione Mortai – 12 x 81mm Mortar
Compagnie Controaerea 77. - 8 x 20mm AA
Compagnie Controaerea 432. - 8 x 20mm AA
---- Division Troops
Battaglione Genio Misto 18.



-- Divisione Fanteria 25. 'Bologna' (mot.)
---- Reggimento Fanteria 39.
UNKNOWN ???

---- Reggimento Fanteria 40.
UNKNOWN ???

---- Reggimento Artiglieria 205.
UNKNOWN ???



-- Divisione Fanteria 27. 'Brescia' (mot.)
---- Reggimento Fanteria 19. (AS42)
Battaglione Fanteria 1./19. – 4 x Compagnie Fucilieri
Battaglione Fanteria 2./19. – 4 x Compagnie Fucilieri
Battaglione Fanteria 3./19. – 4 x Compagnie Fucilieri
---- Reggimento Fanteria 20. (AS42)
Battaglione Fanteria 1./20. – 4 x Compagnie Fucilieri
Battaglione Fanteria 2./20. – 4 x Compagnie Fucilieri
Battaglione Fanteria 3./20. – 4 x Compagnie Fucilieri
---- Reggimento Artiglieria 55.
UNKNOWN ???
---- Division Troops
Battaglione Genio Misto 27.



-- Divisione (Motorizzata) 102. 'Trento'
---- Reggimento (Motorizzato) 61.
Battaglione Fanteria 1./61. – 3 x Compagnie Fucilieri
Battaglione Fanteria 2./61. – 3 x Compagnie Fucilieri
Battaglione Fanteria 3./61. – 3 x Compagnie Fucilieri
---- Reggimento (Motorizzato) 62.
Battaglione Fanteria 1./62. – 3 x Compagnie Fucilieri
Battaglione Fanteria 2./62. – 3 x Compagnie Fucilieri
Battaglione Fanteria 3./62. – 3 x Compagnie Fucilieri
---- Reggimento Artiglieria 46.
Battaglione Artiglieria 1./46. – 12 x 75/27mm Gun
Battaglione Artiglieria 2./46. – 12 x 75/27mm Gun
Battaglione Artiglieria 3./46. – 12 x 100/17mm How.
Battaglione Artiglieria 4./46. – 12 x 100/17mm How.
Compagnie Controaerea 412. – 8 x 20mm AA
Compagnie Controaerea 414. – 8 x 20mm AA
---- Division Troops
Battaglione Genio Misto 51.
Last edited by jurisnik on 21 Aug 2011 08:04, edited 4 times in total.

Jon G.
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Re: Crusader OOB

Post by Jon G. » 20 Aug 2011 18:41


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jurisnik
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Re: Crusader OOB

Post by jurisnik » 20 Aug 2011 23:24

Thanx, that topic is my primary source.
But I also need detailed info to the battalion level, with types of guns, vehicles and such. And I also need allied side as well ..

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jurisnik
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Re: Crusader OOB

Post by jurisnik » 21 Aug 2011 00:01

And here's what I have so far for ALLIED side. Do you have data on number of tanks and guns per each unit? Or some other comments?

Also there is missing data on AT and AA batteries. Feel free to jump in ..


Operation Crusader - ALLIED land OOB

8th Army

XXX Corps

-- 7th Armoured Division
-- -- 4th Armoured Brigade
-- -- -- 8th Hussars
-- -- -- 3rd Royal Tank Regiment
-- -- -- 5th Royal Tank Regiment
-- -- -- 2nd Bn / Scots Guards
-- -- -- 2nd Regiment Royal Horse Artillery
-- -- 7th Armoured Brigade
-- -- -- 7th Hussars
-- -- -- 2nd Royal Tank Regiment
-- -- -- 6th Royal Tank Regiment
-- -- 22nd Armoured Brigade
-- -- -- 2nd Royal Gloucestershire Hussars
-- -- -- 3rd County of London Yeomanry
-- -- -- 4th County of London Yeomanry
-- -- 7th Support Group
-- -- -- 3rd Regiment Royal Horse Artillery
-- -- -- 4th Regiment Royal Horse Artillery
-- -- -- 1st battalion Kings Royal Rifle Corps
-- -- -- 2nd battalion The Rifle Brigade
-- -- -- 60th Field Regiment, Royal Artillery
-- -- -- One Bty, 51st Field Regiment, Royal Artillery
-- -- Division Troops
-- -- -- 4th South African Armoured Car Regiment
-- -- -- King's Dragoon Guards
-- -- -- 11th Hussars
-- -- -- 102nd Royal Horse Artillery
-- -- -- 1st Light Anti-Aircraft Regiment, Royal Artillery



-- 1st South African Division
-- -- 1st South African Infantry Brigade
-- -- -- 1st Bn / Royal Natal Carabineers – 4 x Rifle Co., 1 x Support Co.
-- -- -- 1st Bn / Duke of Edinburgh’s Own Rifles – 4 x Rifle Co., 1 x Support Co.
-- -- -- 1st Bn / Transvaal Scottish – 4 x Rifle Co., 1 x Support Co.
-- -- -- 1st Field Battery / 1st Field Regiment, SAA – 12 x 25# Field Gun
-- -- -- 2nd Field Battery / 1st Field Regiment, SAA – 12 x 25# Field Gun
-- -- -- 1st Field Co., SAEC
-- -- 5th South African Infantry Brigade
-- -- -- UNKNOWN ???



-- 22nd Guards Brigade
-- -- 9th Bn / The Rifle Brigade (Motor) – 3 x Motor Co.
-- -- 3rd Bn / Coldstream Guards Regiment (Motor) – 3 x Motor Co.





XIII Corps

-- 2nd New Zealand Division
-- -- 4th New Zealand Infantry Brigade
-- -- -- 18th Infantry Battalion
-- -- -- 19th Infantry Battalion
-- -- -- 20th Infantry Battalion
-- -- 5th New Zealand Infantry Brigade
-- -- -- 21st Infantry Battalion
-- -- -- 22nd Infantry Battalion
-- -- -- 23rd Infantry Battalion
-- -- 6th New Zealand Infantry Brigade
-- -- -- 24th Infantry Battalion
-- -- -- 25th Infantry Battalion
-- -- -- 26th Infantry Battalion



-- 4th Indian Infantry Division
-- -- 5th Indian Infantry Brigade
-- -- -- 1st Bn / The Buffs
-- -- -- 3rd Bn / 1st Punjab Regiment
-- -- -- 4th Bn / 6th Rajputana Rifles
-- -- 7th Indian Infantry Brigade
-- -- -- 1st Bn / Royal Sussex Regiment
-- -- -- 4th Bn / 11th Sikh Regiment
-- -- -- 4th Bn / 16th Punjab Regiment
-- -- 11th Indian Infantry Brigade
-- -- -- 1st Bn / 6th Rajputana Rifles
-- -- -- 2nd Bn / Queen's Own Cameron Highlanders
-- -- -- 2nd Bn / 5th Mahratta Light Infantry
-- -- Division Troops
-- -- -- The Central India Horse (21st King George V's Own Horse) (Reconnaissance)
-- -- -- 1 Field Regiment, Royal Artillery
-- -- -- 25 Field Regiment, Royal Artillery
-- -- -- 31 Field Regiment, Royal Artillery



-- 1st Army Tank Brigade
-- -- 8th Royal Tank Regiment - Valentine Infantry Tank
-- -- 42nd Royal Tank Regiment
-- -- 44th Royal Tank Regiment - Matilda Mk II Infantry Tank





Tobruk Fortress

-- 70th Infantry Division
-- -- 14th Infantry Brigade
-- -- -- 1st Bn / Bedfordshire and Hertfordshire Regiment
-- -- -- 2nd Bn / Black Watch
-- -- -- 2nd Bn / York and Lancaster Regiment
-- -- 16th Infantry Brigade
-- -- -- 2nd Bn / King's Own Royal Regiment
-- -- -- 2nd Bn / Leicestershire Regiment
-- -- -- 2nd Bn / Queen's Royal Regiment
-- -- 23rd Infantry Brigade
-- -- -- 1st Bn / Durham Light Infantry
-- -- -- 1st Bn / Essex Regiment
-- -- -- 4th Bn / Border Regiment



-- Polish Independent Carpathian Rifle Brigade
-- -- I Carpathian Rifle Battalion
-- -- II Carpathian Rifle Battalion
-- -- III Carpathian Rifle Battalion
-- -- 11 Czechoslovakian Infantry Battalion
-- -- 2/13 Australian Infantry Battalion
-- -- Carpathian Machine Gun Battalion
-- -- Carpathian Field Regiment



-- 32nd Army Tank Brigade
-- -- 1st Royal Tank Regiment
-- -- 4th Royal Tank Regiment
-- -- D Sqn / 7th Royal Tank Regiment





Oasis Force

-- -- 6th South African Armoured Car Regiment - 3 Co. mech
-- 29th Indian Infantry Brigade
-- -- 1st Bn / Worcestershire Regiment – 4 x Rifle Co., 1 x Support Co.
-- -- 3rd Bn / 2nd Punjab Regiment – 4 x Rifle Co., 1 x Support Co.
-- -- 1st Bn / 5th Mahratta Light Infantry – 4 x Rifle Co., 1 x Support Co.
-- -- 29th Indian Infantry Brigade Group AT Co. – 9 x 37mm ATG
-- -- 1st Field Battery / 3rd Field Regiment, RA – 12 x 25# Field Gun
-- -- 2nd Field Battery / 3rd Field Regiment, RA – 12 x 25# Field Gun
-- -- 308th AT Battery, RA – 16 x 2# ATG
-- -- 21st Bombay Field Squadron, IE





Army Reserve

-- 2nd South African Division
-- -- 3rd South African Infantry Brigade Group
-- -- -- 1st Bn / Imperial Light Horse – 4 x Rifle Co., 1 x Support Co.
-- -- -- 1st Bn / Royal Durban Light Infantry – 4 x Rifle Co., 1 x Support Co.
-- -- -- 1st Bn / Rand Light Infantry – 4 x Rifle Co., 1 x Support Co.
-- -- -- 1st Field Battery / 5th Field Regiment, SAA – 12 x 25# Field Gun
-- -- -- 2nd Field Battery / 5th Field Regiment, SAA – 12 x 25# Field Gun
-- -- -- 2nd Field Co., SAEC
-- -- 4th South African Infantry Brigade Group
-- -- -- 2nd Bn / Royal Durban Light Infantry – 4 x Rifle Co., 1 x Support Co.
-- -- -- Umvoti Mounted Rifles – 4 x Rifle Co., 1 x Support Co.
-- -- -- Kaffrarian Rifles – 4 x Rifle Co., 1 x Support Co.
-- -- -- 1st Field Battery / 3rd Field Regiment, SAA – 12 x 25# Field Gun
-- -- -- 2nd Field Battery / 3rd Field Regiment, SAA – 12 x 25# Field Gun
-- -- -- 10th Field Co., SAEC
-- -- 6th South African Infantry Brigade Group
-- -- -- 1st South African Police Battalion – 4 x Rifle Co., 1 x Support Co.
-- -- -- 2nd South African Police Battalion – 3 x Rifle Co., 1 x Support Co.
-- -- -- 2nd Bn / Transvaal Scottish – 1 x Rifle Co.
Last edited by jurisnik on 21 Aug 2011 08:09, edited 1 time in total.

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David W
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Re: Crusader OOB

Post by David W » 21 Aug 2011 00:31

I would like to reply to this article little by little.

I have some disagreements, by which I am not saying that I am right & you are wrong, simply that the information that we have conflicts.

German Artillery:
902 Btr. a.f.a.i.k always 170mm K18, never 15cm.
363 & 364 Btr a.f.a.i.k no 7.5GebK until 1942.
H.K.A.A 523 & 528 a.f.a.i.k both had 155mm Gpft sK 418(f)

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jurisnik
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Re: Crusader OOB

Post by jurisnik » 21 Aug 2011 08:01

Hi David, and thanks for helping out.

I've done a check:

- 902. schwere Artillerie Batterie - you're correct - it should state: 3 x 170mm K. in Mörser Lafette

- 363. & 364. Gebirgs Artillerie Batterie - I can't seem to find correct data. There is some mention of using British 25-pdrs and Russian 7.62cm guns, but no consensus on that (see link: http://www.feldgrau.net/forum/viewtopic ... 9&start=30)

- H.K.A.A 523 & 528 - you're correct - batteries were equipped with canons: 6 x 155mm sK 418(f) (french designation Canon de 155 GPF mle.1917) (see link: http://crusaderproject.wordpress.com/20 ... used-them/)

Bye,

Tom

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Re: Crusader OOB

Post by dor1941 » 21 Aug 2011 10:32

jurisnik

I agree with David W that its best to cope with such a detailed topic in pieces.
I'll deal with the CAM first.
jurisnik wrote:
Corpo d' Armata di' Manovra XX

-- Divisione Corazzata 132. 'Ariete'
---- Reggimento Corazzato 132.
Battaglione Carri 7. - 53 x M13/40-41
Battaglione Carri 8. - 53 x M13/40-41
Battaglione Carri 9. - 53 x M13/40-41
---- Reggimento Bersaglieri 8.
Battaglione Bersaglieri d’accompagnamento 3. (HW) - 1 x Compagnie Controaerea, 1 x Compagnie Mitraglieri,1 x Compagnie Mortai
Battaglione Bersaglieri 5. – 2 x Compagnie Bersaglieri, 1 x Compagnie Controcarri
Battaglione Bersaglieri 12. – 2 x Compagnie Bersaglieri, 1 x Compagnie Controcarri
---- Reggimento Artiglieria 132. (motorized)
Battaglione Artiglieria 1./132. – 12 x 75/27mm Gun
Battaglione Artiglieria 2./132. – 12 x 75/27mm Gun
Battaglione Artiglieria 3./132. – 10 x 105/28mm How.
Battaglione Semovente 551. – 8 x Semovente 75/18 (+ 2 unarmed Command Semovente)
Battaglione Semovente 552. –8 x Semovente 75/18 (+ 2 unarmed Command Semovente)
Battaglione Controaerea 4./132. – 10 x 90mm AA Autocannoni
Battaglione Controaerea 2., Reggimento Artiglieria 24. – 8 x 88mm Flak
---- Division Troops
Battaglione Carri 3., Reggimento "Lancieri di Novara" (2 Co.) – 33 x L6/40
Battaglione Autoblinda 3., Reggimento "Nizza Cavalleria" (2 Co.) – 40 x AB41
Battaglione Genio Misto 32.
To begin with, the CAM was not redesignated the XX corpo d'armata until early 1942. Also, many of the units cited here did not arrive in NA until 1942-notably, the semovente, L6/40 and AB41 units shown here were not present in Crusader, Nov. 18 (Eighth Army crosses the Wire) to Dec. 17 (Rommel retreats from Gazala). Your list omits RECAM altogether. Only four L6-a plotone-was present (for field trials) in the single compagnia of "Nizza Cavalleria" in RECAM.

The following is from the Italian official history, Le operazioni in Africa Settentrionale, vol. II-Tobruk, Mario Montanari, primarily pp. 349 and 426, and with some additional information from other sources in italics.

"Quadro di battaglia del Corpo D'Armata di Manovra al 17 Novembre 1941

Comandante: generale di corpo d'armata Gastone Gambara
Gen. addetto: generale di brigata Alberto Mannerini
Capo di Stato Maggiore: ten. col. Carlo Scaglia

132ª Divisione Corazzata Ariete: generale di divisione M. Balotta
Secondo al comando: generale di brigata Di Nisio
8º reggimento bersaglieri
-V battaglione autoportati (probably two rifle and one 47/32 c.c. compagnie)
-XII battaglione autoportati (probably two rifle and one 47/32 c.c. compagnie)
-III battaglione armi d'accompagnamento (one compagnia each of machine-guns, 81mm mortars and 20/65 c.a.)
132º reggimento carri medi (137 M13/40 tanks)
-VII battaglione (3 compagnie M13/40)
-VIII battaglione (3 compagnie M13/40)
-IX battaglione (3 compagnie M13/40)
-batteria da 20/65 c.a.
32º reggimento carri leggeri
-(two battaglioni of 2 compagnie each, reportedly with 52 L3/35-a third btg was with RECAM)
132º reggimento artiglieria
-(two gruppi-12 pieces each, in 3 batterie-da 75/27, and 2 batterie da 20/65 c.a.)
-(also attached: one gruppo da 75/27-8 pieces-from 3º reggimento celere and one gruppo da 105/28-12 pieces-from the 24º raggruppamento artiglieria di corpo di armata)
CXXXII battaglione misto genio
nucleo esplorante divisionale: one compagnia motociclisti with plotone AB 41 armoured cars
battaglione divisionale controcarro: one compagnia each of 47/32 c.c. and motociclisti
servizi di divisione



-- Divisione Motorizzata 101. 'Trieste'
---- Reggimento Motorizzato 65.
Battaglione Motorizzato 1./65. – 3 x Compagnie Fucilieri
Battaglione Motorizzato 2./65. – 3 x Compagnie Fucilieri
---- Reggimento Motorizzato 66.
Battaglione Motorizzato 1./66. – 3 x Compagnie Fucilieri
Battaglione Motorizzato 2./66. – 3 x Compagnie Fucilieri
---- Reggimento Bersaglieri 9.
Battaglione Autoblinda Bersaglieri 8. (2 Co.)
---- Reggimento Artiglieria 21. (motorized)
Battaglione Artiglieria 1./21. – 10 x 75/27mm Gun
Battaglione Artiglieria 2./21. – 10 x 75/27mm Gun
Battaglione Artiglieria 3./21. – 12 x 100/17mm How.
Battaglione Artiglieria 4./21. - 12 x 100/17mm How.
Battaglione Controaerea 5./21. – 12 x 75mm Flak
Compagnie Controaerea 146. – 8 x 20mm AA
Compagnie Controaerea 411. – 8 x 20mm AA
---- Division Troops
Battaglione Carri 11. – 53 x M13/40-41
Battaglione Genio Misto 52. (motorized)
I must disagree with most of this for Divisione Trieste-there were certainly no tanks in the division during Crusader.

101ª Divisione Motorizzata Trieste: generale di divisione A. Piazzoni
65º reggimento fanteria
-(I and II battaglioni fucilieri-probably three compagnie each-and III battaglione armi d'accompagnamento-one compagnia each of mortai da 81, 47/32 c.c. and 20/65 c.a. )
66º reggimento fanteria
-(I believe the I, II and III battaglioni were all mixed fucilieri and heavy weapons during Crusader)
9º reggimento bersaglieri
-XXVIII battaglione autoportati (probably two rifle and one 47/32 compagnie)
-XXX battaglione autoportati (probably two rifle and one 47/32 compagnie)
-XXXII battaglione motociclisti (three compagnie motociclisti)
-XL battaglione (one compagnia each of machine-guns, 81mm mortars and 20/65 c.a.)
21º reggimento artiglieria
-(I gruppo with 12 obice da 100/17 and II and III gruppi each with three batterie and 12 cannoni da 75/27)
-(IX gruppo da 105/28 with 12 pieces in three batterie)
-XXI gruppo contraerei (one batteria each of 75/27 CK-four pieces-and 20/65 c.a.-8 pieces)
DVIII battaglione armi d'accompagnamento (one compagnia each of machine-guns, 81mm mortars and 47/32 c.c.)
LII battaglione misto genio (probably with one compagnia each of artieri-engineers-and collegamenti-signals)
Servizi di divisione

I'll list RECAM later...

David R
Last edited by dor1941 on 21 Aug 2011 14:49, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Crusader OOB

Post by dor1941 » 21 Aug 2011 14:19

continuing with the CAM...

Ragruppamento esplorante del Corpo d'Armata di Manovra: colonnello De Meo
Gruppo di battaglioni GG.FF. (Giovani Fascisti)
-(I and II battaglioni GG.FF with three compagnie each, and attached Bersaglieri elements of machine-guns and 47/32 c.c.)
battaglione Polizia Africa Italiana (PAI) "R. Gessi" (two compagnie motociclisti and one compagnia AB 41)
Gruppo di squadroni artiglieria "Voloire" (truck-mounted artillery)
-(I and III squadroni of 3 batterie each of 65/17, with one separate batteria 65/17, and one batteria each of obice da 100/17 and 20/65 c.a. )
two batterie MILMART (see below)
III btg. 32º rgt. carri leggeri (L3/35)
one compagnia with nine M13/40 (LII battaglione-in formazione)
compagnia sperimentale del "Nizza Cavalleria" (four L6/40 and some AB 41 armoured cars)

Supporti di corpo d'armata
III gruppo Milizia Artiglieria Marittima (MILMART) (three batterie of naval 102/35 truck-mounted c.a., serving with Ariete and RECAM)
battaglione genio autoportato G
67º gruppo O.A. (less one squadriglia) (light observation aircraft)

David R

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Re: Crusader OOB

Post by jurisnik » 21 Aug 2011 20:46

Hi David R, and thanks for helping out! I agree - this is a detailed OOB and one must check it step-by-step.

I agree with your comments and will correct the OOB for CAM .. here we go:


Corpo d' Armata di' Manovra

-- Divisione Corazzata 132. 'Ariete'
-- -- Reggimento Carri Medi 132. (137 M13/40 tanks)
-- -- -- Battaglione 7. - 3 compagnie M13/40
-- -- -- Battaglione 8. - 3 compagnie M13/40
-- -- -- Battaglione 9. - 3 compagnie M13/40
-- -- -- Batteria da 20/65 c.a.
-- -- Reggimento Bersaglieri 8.
-- -- -- Battaglione Autoportati 5. (probably two rifle and one 47/32 c.c. compagnie)
-- -- -- Battaglione Autoportati 12. (probably two rifle and one 47/32 c.c. compagnie)
-- -- -- Battaglione Armi D'accompagnamento 3. (one compagnia each of machine-guns, 81mm mortars and 20/65 c.a.)
-- -- Reggimento Carri Leggeri 32. (two battaglioni of 2 compagnie each, reportedly with 52 L3/35-a third btg was with RECAM)
-- -- -- Battaglione Carri Leggeri - 2 compagnie L3/35
-- -- -- Battaglione Carri Leggeri - 2 compagnie L3/35
-- -- Reggimento Artiglieria 132. (motorized)
-- -- -- Gruppo Artiglieria 1. - 12 x 75/27mm Gun
-- -- -- Gruppo Artiglieria 2. - 12 x 75/27mm Gun
-- -- -- Gruppo Artiglieria - 8 x 75/27 (attached from 3º reggimento celere)
-- -- -- Gruppo Artiglieria - 12 x 105/28 (attached from the 24º raggruppamento artiglieria di corpo di armata)
-- -- -- 2 batterie da 20/65 c.a.
-- -- Division Troops
-- -- -- Battaglione Genio Misto 132.
-- -- -- Nucleo esplorante divisionale (one compagnia motociclisti with plotone AB 41 armoured cars)
-- -- -- Battaglione divisionale controcarro (one compagnia each of 47/32 c.c. and motociclisti)
-- -- -- Servizi di divisione



-- Divisione Motorizzata 101. 'Trieste'
-- -- Reggimento Fanteria 65.
-- -- -- Battaglione Fucilieri 1./65. – 3 x Compagnie Fucilieri
-- -- -- Battaglione Fucilieri 2./65. – 3 x Compagnie Fucilieri
-- -- -- Battaglione Armi d’accompagnamento (one compagnia each of mortai da 81, 47/32 c.c. and 20/65 c.a.)
-- -- Reggimento Fanteria 66.
-- -- -- Battaglione Fucilieri 1./66. (mixed fucilieri and heavy weapons)
-- -- -- Battaglione Fucilieri 2./66. (mixed fucilieri and heavy weapons)
-- -- -- Battaglione Fucilieri 3./66. (mixed fucilieri and heavy weapons)
-- -- Reggimento Bersaglieri 9.
-- -- -- Battaglione Autoportati 28. (probably two rifle and one 47/32 compagnie)
-- -- -- Battaglione Autoportati 30. (probably two rifle and one 47/32 compagnie)
-- -- -- Battaglione Motociclisti 32. (three compagnie motociclisti)
-- -- -- Battaglione 40. (one compagnia each of machine-guns, 81mm mortars and 20/65 c.a.)
-- -- Reggimento Artiglieria 21. (motorized)
-- -- -- Gruppo Artiglieria 1. – 12 x 100/17mm How.
-- -- -- Gruppo Artiglieria 2. – 12 x 75/27mm Gun
-- -- -- Gruppo Artiglieria 3. – 12 x 75/27mm Gun
-- -- -- Gruppo Artiglieria 4. – 12 x 105/28
-- -- -- Gruppo Contraerei 21. - 4 x 75/27, 8 x 20/65
-- -- Division Troops
-- -- -- Battaglione Armi d’accompagnamento 508 (one compagnia each of machine-guns, 81mm mortars and 47/32 c.c.)
-- -- -- Battaglione Genio Misto 52. (probably with one compagnia each of artieri-engineers-and collegamenti-signals)
-- -- -- Servizi di divisione



-- Ragruppamento esplorante del Corpo d'Armata di Manovra (RECAM)
-- -- Gruppo di battaglioni GG.FF. (Giovani Fascisti)
-- -- -- Battaglione GG.FF 1. - 3 x Compagnie
-- -- -- Battaglione GG.FF 2. - 3 x Compagnie
-- -- -- Attached Bersaglieri elements of machine-guns
-- -- -- Attached 47/32 c.c.
-- -- Gruppo di squadroni artiglieria 'Voloire' (truck-mounted artillery)
-- -- -- Squadrone 1. - 12 x 65/17
-- -- -- Squadrone 3. - 12 x 65/17
-- -- -- Batteria - 4 x 65/17 (separate)
-- -- -- Batteria - 4 x 100/17mm How.
-- -- -- Batteria da 20/65 c.a.
-- -- Ragruppamento Troops
-- -- -- Battaglione Polizia Africa Italiana (PAI) "R. Gessi" (two compagnie motociclisti and one compagnia AB 41)
-- -- -- 2 batterie MILMART (2 batterie of naval 102/35 truck-mounted c.a., see below)
-- -- -- Battaglione 3. / Reggimento Carri Leggeri 32. - 2 compagnie L3/35 ?
-- -- -- Compagnia - 9 x M13/40 (LII battaglione-in formazione)
-- -- -- Compagnia sperimentale del 'Nizza Cavalleria' - 4 x L6/40 and some AB 41 armoured cars



-- Supporti di corpo d'armata (Corps Suport Troops)
-- -- Gruppo Milizia Artiglieria Marittima 3. (MILMART) (3 batterie of naval 102/35 truck-mounted c.a., serving with Ariete and RECAM)
-- -- Battaglione Genio Autoportato G
-- -- Gruppo O.A. 67. (less one squadriglia) (light observation aircraft)

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Re: Crusader OOB

Post by jurisnik » 21 Aug 2011 23:57

I've completed detailed info on "Savona" and "Bologna" divisions.

Still missing data on Reggimento Artiglieria 55. and AT and AA units for allied side ..

Here's the update:

-- Divisione Fanteria 55. "Savona" (mot., A.S. 40 Type)
-- -- Reggimento Fanteria 15. (Each battalion staff, three rifle companies with 12 light MGs each, and one support company with 18 4.5cm mortars and 8 anti-tank rifles.)
-- -- -- Battaglione Fanteria 1./15. – 4 x Compagnie
-- -- -- Battaglione Fanteria 2./15. – 4 x Compagnie - in Bardia
-- -- -- Battaglione Fanteria 3./15. – 4 x Compagnie
-- -- -- Battaglione Mortai – 6 x 81mm Mortar
-- -- Reggimento Fanteria 16. (Each battalion staff, three rifle companies with 12 light MGs each, and one support company with 18 4.5cm mortars and 8 anti-tank rifles.)
-- -- -- Battaglione Fanteria 1./16. – 4 x Compagnie
-- -- -- Battaglione Fanteria 2./16. – 4 x Compagnie - in Bardia
-- -- -- Battaglione Fanteria 3./16. – 4 x Compagnie
-- -- -- Battaglione Mortai – 6 x 81mm Mortar
-- -- -- Compagnia - 5 x 65mm infantry gun
-- -- Reggimento Artiglieria 12.
-- -- -- Battaglione Artiglieria 1./12. – not present - 1st and 2nd batteries (4/5 howitzers, respectively) sunk; 3rd battery of 4 howitzers in Naples
-- -- -- Battaglione Artiglieria 2./12. – 8 x 100/17mm How. (third battery in Naples)
-- -- -- Battaglione Artiglieria 3./12. – 14 x 75/27mm Gun
-- -- -- 8th independent battery with 2 coastal defense guns of unknown calibre
-- -- -- 27th independent battery with 6 coastal defense guns of unknown calibre
-- -- -- 503rd and 504th independent battery with 8 coastal defense guns each of unknown calibre
-- -- -- 3 x Compagnie Controcarri with 47/32mm AT Gun
-- -- -- Compagnie Controaerea with 20mm AA
-- -- -- Battaglione Controcarri 255. - 8 x 37mm ATG, 4 x 47/32mm AT Gun
-- -- Division Troops
-- -- -- Battaglione Genio Misto 55.



-- Divisione Fanteria 25. "Bologna" (mot.)
-- -- Reggimento Fanteria 39. (each battalion with three companies 12 MG and 6 light mortars, plus one company Covering Firearms with 9 8 mm MG and 9 heavy mortars)
-- -- -- Battaglione Fanteria 1./39. – 4 x Compagnie Fucilieri
-- -- -- Battaglione Fanteria 2./39. – 4 x Compagnie Fucilieri
-- -- -- Battaglione Fanteria 3./39. – 4 x Compagnie Fucilieri
-- -- -- Compagnia - 4 x 65/17mm infantry gun
-- -- -- Compagnia Controcarri 73. - 8 x 47/32mm AT Gun (from 3rd Bersaglieri Regiment)
-- -- Reggimento Fanteria 40. (each battalion with three companies 12 MG and 6 light mortars, plus one company Covering Firearms with 9 8 mm MG and 9 heavy mortars)
-- -- -- Battaglione Fanteria 1./40. – 4 x Compagnie Fucilieri
-- -- -- Battaglione Fanteria 2./40. – 4 x Compagnie Fucilieri
-- -- -- Battaglione Fanteria 3./40. – 4 x Compagnie Fucilieri
-- -- -- Compagnia - 4 x 65/17mm infantry gun
-- -- -- Compagnia Controcarri 44. - 8 x 47/32mm AT Gun
-- -- Reggimento Artiglieria 205.
-- -- -- Battaglione Artiglieria 1./205. – 12 x 100/17mm How.
-- -- -- Battaglione Artiglieria 2./205. – 12 x 75/27mm Gun
-- -- -- Battaglione Artiglieria 3./205. – 12 x 75/27mm Gun
-- -- -- Battaglione Artiglieria 4./205. – 12 x 75/27mm Gun
-- -- -- Compagnie Controaerea 4. - 8 x 20/35mm AA Gun
-- -- -- Compagnie Controaerea 437. - 8 x 20/35mm AA Gun
-- -- Division Troops
-- -- -- Battaglione Carri Leggeri 4. - 2 compagnie L3/35 ?
-- -- -- 25th Antitank and Covering Firearms (formed in October 1941 for shift of the 25th MG Battalion) - consists of: 20th Antitank Company (8 47/32 guns), MG Company (12 8 mm MG), Mortars Company. (6 81 mm mortars)
-- -- -- Battaglione Genio Misto 25.

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Re: Crusader OOB

Post by David W » 22 Aug 2011 00:31

You guys are way ahead of me! (Curse these 14 hour working days, and four in a row to boot)

I was going to post about Ariete next, but David R has beaten me to it.
I won't double post his amendments, but will just say that I have three batteries of 20/65 not two. And that I thought that the II Btg c.c (Div) was 2 x Compagnia c.c (I have no M/C).

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Re: Crusader OOB

Post by David W » 22 Aug 2011 00:48

Re Trieste....

XL Btg A.A had the 105th c.c.c so maybe it had 4x Compagnia in total?

I have no DVIII Btg A.A I hope I am wrong, and that there was one!
But I do have
CVIII Btg c.c (24x 47/32). This might be typo for the above, or a different unit altogether, or a mane & designation change perhaps. Either way I would appreciate clarification.

The heavy c.a Bty I have as 75/50 not 75/27ck

And finally I have no IX Gruppo with 105/28 in 21st Regiment. Perhaps it was a temporary secondment?

D.A.K next, probably tomorrow.

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Re: Crusader OOB

Post by dor1941 » 22 Aug 2011 11:42

David W wrote:Re Trieste....

XL Btg A.A had the 105th c.c.c so maybe it had 4x Compagnia in total?
Do you have an Italian source for this compagnia c.c. in Crusader?
I have no DVIII Btg A.A I hope I am wrong, and that there was one!
But I do have
CVIII Btg c.c (24x 47/32). This might be typo for the above, or a different unit altogether, or a mane & designation change perhaps. Either way I would appreciate clarification.
I recall reading a posted discussion on the Comando Supremo Forum between you, Jeff Leser and Andreas in the Topic "Battaglione a.a. e a.c." about this very issue (note your post of 27 March 2009-07:54 am) and the conclusion I drew was that the DVIII btg armi d'accompagnamento (supported by Loi's Aggredisci e Vincerai) was real and that the CVIII btg was fiction. (Montanari also lists this btg a.a. on p. 426, but with the typo DVII instead of DVIII).
Is my conclusion incorrect?
The heavy c.a Bty I have as 75/50 not 75/27ck
I was reciting Davide Pastore's summary of Storia della Artiglieria Italiana, Parte V, Volume XVI, also from the CS Forum. What source do you have for the 75/50 c.a.?
And finally I have no IX Gruppo with 105/28 in 21st Regiment. Perhaps it was a temporary secondment?
Again, I'm citing Pastore's summary on the CS Forum. Even as a temporary secondment the gruppo would have been subordinated to the 21º reggimento artiglieria.

David R

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Re: Crusader OOB

Post by dor1941 » 22 Aug 2011 13:01

jurisnik wrote: -- 15. Panzer Division
----
---- Division Troops

1./43. Luftwaffe Flak Regiment (mot.) (attached) – 9 x 88mm Flak
2./43. Luftwaffe Flak Regiment (mot.) (attached) – 9 x 88mm Flak
3./43. Luftwaffe Flak Regiment (mot.) (attached) – 12 x 20mm Flak
4./43. Luftwaffe Flak Regiment (mot.) (attached) – 12 x 20mm Flak
I openly confess the urge to squash the perverse notion that I./Flak-Regiment 43 was any part of Panzergruppe Afrika in November 1941. Horst-Adalbert Koch-in Flak: Die Geschichte der Deutschen Flakartillerie-does not mention the presence of this gemischte flakabteilung in Afrika until August 1942.
To my knowledge the only mixed flak battalions operating in the immediate area of the Panzergruppe (Tobruk-Bardia-Halfaya-Gabr Saleh) were the I./Flak 18, I./Flak 33 and the II./Flak 25. I understood the reason the II./Flak 25 doesn't appear on any order of battle for Panzergruppe Afrika is that-while it was operating within the latters area-it was in fact subordinate to Luftgaustab z.b.V. Afrika. It was tasked with the air defense of the Gambut landing ground, which was quickly abandoned when 4th New Zealand Brigade approached it on Nov. 23, '41 during Freyberg's advance on Tobruk.

So please, no more imaginary gemischte flakabteilungen produced for Crusader :roll:

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Re: Crusader OOB

Post by Oasis » 22 Aug 2011 14:21

jurisnik wrote: Still missing data on Reggimento Artiglieria 55. and AT and AA units for allied side ..
Reggimento Artiglieria 55. was destroyed in Compass.
For Crusader Brescia had:

27. Divisione Fanteria Brescia (Gen. Gioda)
- 19° rgt ftr (2 btg)
- 20° rgt ftr (3 btg)
- 1° rgt Artiglieria Celere (Articelere) on three (plus two) Gruppi:
I° with 12 Howitzer 100/17 on three batterie
II° and III° with 12 camp 75/27-11 on two batterie [(-) the second batteria of each gruppo has only personnel and no guns]
plus:
XVIII° with eight 88/55 AA
V° with sixteen 20/65 AA
plus:
7^ batteria with eight 20/65 AA
8^ batteria with eight 20/65 AA
27° Battaglione Mitraglieri

ciao, Toni

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