Mortar Battalions

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kereguelen
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Mortar Battalions

#1

Post by kereguelen » 10 Oct 2011, 16:21

Hello,

I never understood the designations of Japanese Mortar Battalions because there seems to be an issue with translations from Japanese into English:

As far as I can tell, there were some Independent Heavy Mortar Battalions fielding 27cm Type 14 Mortars (1st, 21st - 22nd, 24th -27th).

And there were some Medium Mortar Battalions (sometimes called 'Medium Trench Mortar Battalions') fielding a mixture of 15cm and 81mm or 90mm Mortars).

But the confusing Mortar Battalions are the following:

It seems that there were two (different?) kinds of 'Independent Mortar Battalions' :

1st, 4th, 5th, 13th -22nd, 42nd, 43rd Independent Mortar Battalions (fielding 81mm Mortars?)

and

1st - 32nd and 37th and 40th Independent Mortar Battalions (fielding 81mm Mortars as well?)

The latter are named in some sources as 'Trench Mortar Battalions' and were found in Japan and Korea.

To further add to the confusion is that it seems that some Independent Mortar Battalions fielded 32cm Type 98 Mortars instead of 81mm Mortars.

Please, can somebody shed some light on this!

Many Thanks!

'K'

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Akira Takizawa
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Re: Mortar Battalions

#2

Post by Akira Takizawa » 10 Oct 2011, 18:10

> As far as I can tell, there were some Independent Heavy Mortar Battalions fielding 27cm Type 14 Mortars (1st, 21st - 22nd, 24th -27th).

Type 14 27cm Mortar was produced in only one piece. They are 独立迫砲大隊(Independent Mortar Battalion). It was equipped with 15cm Mortars or Type 98 32cm Spigot Mortars.

> It seems that there were two (different?) kinds of 'Independent Mortar Battalions' :

> 1st, 4th, 5th, 13th -22nd, 42nd, 43rd Independent Mortar Battalions (fielding 81mm Mortars?)

They are 迫撃大隊.

> 1st - 32nd and 37th and 40th Independent Mortar Battalions (fielding 81mm Mortars as well?)

They are 迫撃砲大隊.

Both 迫撃大隊 and 迫撃砲大隊 are translated Mortar Battalion. So, they are very confusing. 迫撃大隊 were formed since Sino-Japanese War and equipped with Type 94 90mm Infantry Morters. 迫撃砲大隊 were formed in 1945 for Japan homeland defense and equipped with Type 2 120mm Infantry Mortars.

Taki


kereguelen
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Re: Mortar Battalions

#3

Post by kereguelen » 18 Oct 2011, 17:47

Thanks for the reply, Akira-san!

Needed some time to digest this. If you don't mind, some more questions about Mortar units.

(1)
A Japanese language website mentions 42nd and 43rd Mortar Battalions (迫撃大隊) as part of 32nd Army on Okinawa. US sources about the Japanese order of battle on Okinawa (Operation Iceberg) mention the 1st and 2nd "Light Mortar Battalions" but not the 42nd and 43rd Mortar Battalions. Were these the same units? Formed on Okinawa?

(2)
Do you know when exactly the 迫撃砲大隊 with the 12cm Mortars were formed in 1945? There is next to nothing about the Japanese 12cm Mortar and the units which fielded it (probably because it was never encountered - or never encountered in numbers - by Allied forces).

And did the 201st, 202nd, 205th, 206th, 209th, 212th, 214th and 216th Mortar Regiments (as parts of the divisions with the same numbers) field the 12cm Mortar as well?

3)
The designations of Japanese mortar battalions are indeed confusing. Do I understand it correctly that both 独立迫砲大隊 and 迫撃大隊 fielded 32cm Spigot Mortars? This seems to have been the case (according to the list of artillery battles on your homepage). If yes, do you know which battalions fielded 32cm and which 81mm or 90mm?

4)
Do you know when and where the Medium Mortar Battalions were formed?

Many Thanks!

'K'

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Akira Takizawa
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Re: Mortar Battalions

#4

Post by Akira Takizawa » 19 Oct 2011, 03:17

(1)
A Japanese language website mentions 42nd and 43rd Mortar Battalions (迫撃大隊) as part of 32nd Army on Okinawa. US sources about the Japanese order of battle on Okinawa (Operation Iceberg) mention the 1st and 2nd "Light Mortar Battalions" but not the 42nd and 43rd Mortar Battalions. Were these the same units? Formed on Okinawa?

I don't know what US sources mean by 1st and 2nd "Light Mortar Battalions". Anyway, such units as "Light Mortar Battalions" did not exist on Okinawa.

(2)
Do you know when exactly the 迫撃砲大隊 with the 12cm Mortars were formed in 1945?

Early June - 4th, 5th
Middle June - 12th, 13th, 16th, 17th, 24th, 25th
Early July - 6th, 7th, 29th
Middle July - 18th, 19th, 20th, 26th, 27th, 28th
Early Aug. - 1st, 2nd, 14th, 15th, 30th, 31st
Middle Aug. - 21st, 22nd
Sept. - 3rd, 10th, 11th, 23rd, 32nd

The 迫撃砲大隊 after early Aug. were actually not formed.

> And did the 201st, 202nd, 205th, 206th, 209th, 212th, 214th and 216th Mortar Regiments (as parts of the divisions with the same numbers) field the 12cm Mortar as well?

Yes

3)
The designations of Japanese mortar battalions are indeed confusing. Do I understand it correctly that both 独立迫砲大隊 and 迫撃大隊 fielded 32cm Spigot Mortars? This seems to have been the case (according to the list of artillery battles on your homepage). If yes, do you know which battalions fielded 32cm and which 81mm or 90mm?

As I said, 独立迫砲大隊 fielded 32cm Spigot Mortars. 迫撃大隊 fielded 81mm or 90mm mortars.

4)
Do you know when and where the Medium Mortar Battalions were formed?

The 2nd was formed at Kurume, Fukuoka on June 22nd, 1944. The 3rd was formed at Tokyo on June 20th, 1944. Others are unknown. But, probably almost the same period. I don't know the detailed places where they were formed, but in Japan homeland.

Taki

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Re: Mortar Battalions

#5

Post by john whitman » 19 Oct 2011, 14:54

kereguelen:

Hve you seen this (and other artillery at this site)?

迫撃連隊

連隊 最終連隊長 編成時期 編成地 符 終戦上官 終戦地
迫撃第201連隊 塩田 一 昭和20年4月2日 柏 武蔵 第201師団 橋本
迫撃第202連隊 楢崎五郎 昭和20年4月2日 仙台 青葉 第202師団 沼田
迫撃第205連隊 指宿三郎 昭和20年4月2日 広島 安芸 第205師団 後免町
迫撃第206連隊 岡本成雄 昭和20年4月2日 熊本 阿蘇 第206師団 伊作町
迫撃第209連隊 大江芳若 昭和20年4月2日 鯖江 加越 第209師団 金沢
迫撃第212連隊 永田敏夫 昭和20年4月2日 久留米 菊池 第212師団 都農
迫撃第214連隊 桑田謹彰 昭和20年4月2日 鯖江 常磐 第214師団 北関東
迫撃第216連隊 幡川錬治 昭和20年4月2日 京都 比叡 第216師団 宇土

//homepage1.nifty.com/kitabatake/rikukaigun45.2.html

John

kereguelen
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Re: Mortar Battalions

#6

Post by kereguelen » 19 Oct 2011, 15:53

@ Taki: Many Thanks! I'm propably somewhat dense when it comes to the mortar units, but the (English language) sources I use are more than confusing and often contradict each other.

@ John: Many Thanks as well. I already knew about this site. It's fantastic but (sadly) doesn't cover battalion-sized (and smaller) units which I'm currently researching (artillery battalions, mortar battalions, machine gun battalions). But let me compliment here your efforts and the efforts of fontessa which are immensely useful for me as well! Some real eye-openers!

john whitman
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Re: Mortar Battalions

#7

Post by john whitman » 19 Oct 2011, 20:03

Hello Kereguelen:

If you are interested in indepedent machine gun battalions (7.7mm AA), here is a nice story about the 13th. This is a Babel Fish translation. My comments are in brackets.


"1944 July 25th, 13th Independent Machine Gun BN (the dignity 17,652 unit) was formed to the Kurume regiment there. Among these men are elderly soldiers like my parents selected as replacements [?] who exceed 40 years old. They suffered hardships and were not well trained, they were only ammunition carriers.

July 30th Kurume departure, Moji port arrival. We stayed about five days in the private house.

Around August 5, we started on our voyage, but the screw of the transport broke down with the Nagasaki adjacent waters, repair ended the Moji port in about one month entering the Nagasaki dry dock. It united the fleet with 12 [Convoy HI-71, departed August 10] and entered port into Gaoxing of departure and Taiwan again, loaded the water and the food there, evening started on a voyage. But, that night, we encountered an attack of an enemy submarine with the Taiwan adjacent waters, the torpedo hit the aircraft carrier [Taiyo]. The warship tilted on the opposite side which first receives the torpedo, collapsed on the side where the torpedo hit next and sank.

Half or more of the fleet sank by torpedoes, the fire ignited to the oil which flowed out in and it probably means that many people die in the sea of the fire, but also the warships of guard everyone dispersed evacuated at one time to seem. In any case, we arrived at Manila on September 8. Our boats because it escapes to right wing did not receive either the torpedo one shot, it was intact and it landed."

Source or the above is //www.heiwakinen.jp/shiryokan/heiwa/08onk ... _179_1.pdf

//www1.odn.ne.jp/tobu7757/J_wsd/armydate/unit/bs_list_x.htm list independent machine gun battalions as numbers 1 through 26 , but it does not list 6, 11, 12, and 23. Do you know anything about them? I believe all these independent machine gun battalions were created in 1944, maybe starting in June.

John

kereguelen
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Re: Mortar Battalions

#8

Post by kereguelen » 28 Oct 2011, 11:05

Hello John,

thanks for the info about the 13th MG Bn. This was very helpful and confirms the limited information about Japanese MG Battalions I have. My sources do not mention the existence of any MG Battalions before July 1944. I'll look into my sources this weekend, maybe there is something about the 6th, 11th, 12th and 23rd MG Battalions.

Btw., the MG Battalions seem to be quite interesting units, equipped with just 24 7.7mm MG and 100 rifles. Seems that they were ad-hoc formed for static defense duties.

kereguelen
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Re: Mortar Battalions

#9

Post by kereguelen » 28 Oct 2011, 23:29

About 11th and 12th Independent Machine Gun Battalions I have found the following (all from Madej):

Both were on Luzon in October 1944. 12th was formed at Omura. Nothing else.

And nothing about 6th and 23rd, only that they existed at some time.

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fontessa
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Re: Mortar Battalions

#10

Post by fontessa » 29 Oct 2011, 10:31

Hello Kereguelen and John,
kereguelen wrote: And nothing about 6th and 23rd, only that they existed at some time.
The 6th Independent Machine Gun Battalion(達17406) was formed at Asahikawa by Army Regulation “A” No91 dated on 21 July 1944. The 23rd Independent Machine Gun Battalion(達14201) was formed at Kawasaki by the same Army Regulation “A”. Both battalions were assigned to the 5th Area Army.

fontessa

john whitman
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Re: Mortar Battalions

#11

Post by john whitman » 29 Oct 2011, 11:49

Hello fontessa:

Can you find any travel information about the 11th and 12th Independent Machine Gun Battalions? When did they depart Japan? I cannot find them in the US Army history of the Philippines campaign. Maybe they were sunk?

John

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fontessa
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Re: Mortar Battalions

#12

Post by fontessa » 29 Oct 2011, 13:27

Hello John,

Unfortunately the record of both battalions is not left in 部隊略歴. Because Kereguelen said that they had been in Luzon in 1944, I don't think that the battalions were sunk. They might have been deleted from OOB because they had annihilated.

fontessa

john whitman
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Re: Mortar Battalions

#13

Post by john whitman » 29 Oct 2011, 19:03

Good morning fontessa:

Thanks for checking.

John

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