German army at Don

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Auceps
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German army at Don

Post by Auceps » 02 Feb 2012 23:19

Hello!

Can anybody help me? What troops were situated in a place named Kantemirovka during Operation Blau in 1942? This place is not so far from Kalach-na-Donu.

Thanks in advance! :)

Auceps

Rchrd
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Re: German army at Don

Post by Rchrd » 04 Feb 2012 02:11

I think 3rd Pz went right through it in early july. I don't know for sure which, if any, Infantry divisions passed through. In what context are you asking?

Auceps
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Re: German army at Don

Post by Auceps » 04 Feb 2012 14:18

Oh, thanks!

Just know some people, who were lived in Kantemirovka in 1942. :)

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JC
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Re: German army at Don

Post by JC » 05 Feb 2012 20:21

Auceps,

The 3rd Panzerdivision and the 23rd Panzerdivision passed thru Kantemirovka in July 1942, while the 387 Infanteriedivision and the 27th Panzerdivision held positions near there in December '42.

JC

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tigre
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Re: German army at Don

Post by tigre » 06 Feb 2012 23:30

Hello Auceps :D; take a look on the map below.........................
The 3rd Panzerdivision and the 23rd Panzerdivision passed thru Kantemirovka in July 1942
by JC

Other German divisions which passed through/fought in Kantemirowka: 79 ID (Hier verblieb die Division bis in den Sommer 1942. Während der deutschen Sommeroffensive zum Don und in Richtung Stalingrad kämpfte sich die Division über Waluiki, Kantemirowka bis nach Stariza am Don vor)
http://www.lexikon-der-wehrmacht.de/Gli ... 79ID-R.htm

294 ID (24.07.1942 Div.-Gefechtsstand in Pissarewka. 29.07.1942 Es herrscht starker Betriebsstoffmangel, mot. Teile der Division wie Pz.Jäg.Abt, Teile N.A. und Teile mot. Kolonnen müssen im Raum Holaja – Michailowka –
Kantemirowka bleiben.
http://www.294id.de/html/294_allgemein.html

Cheers. Raúl M 8-).
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Auceps
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Re: German army at Don

Post by Auceps » 22 Feb 2012 15:57

Oh, thank you, JC and tigre!! :) :) :)

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Leo Niehorster
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Re: German army at Don

Post by Leo Niehorster » 22 Feb 2012 16:17

@ tigre
Hi,
Are you sure about German units in or passing through Kantemirovka?

The Soviet 3rd Tank Army was in occupation November 1942 — January 1943, before the big offensive against Army Group Center. (See attached). Or were the Germans/Italians driven out of this city at some time?
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Urmel
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Re: German army at Don

Post by Urmel » 22 Feb 2012 16:48

Well there was an Italian airfield at Kantemriovska in late 41. I would guess it was liberated during the encirclement of Stalingrad?
The enemy had superiority in numbers, his tanks were more heavily armoured, they had larger calibre guns with nearly twice the effective range of ours, and their telescopes were superior. 5 RTR 19/11/41

The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle 1941/42

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Leo Niehorster
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Re: German army at Don

Post by Leo Niehorster » 22 Feb 2012 18:03

Hi,
The map might be wrong, and the Axis lines should include Kantemorivka. Will check my sources.
Cheers
Leo

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Urmel
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Re: German army at Don

Post by Urmel » 22 Feb 2012 18:23

It might be from after 23 November?
The enemy had superiority in numbers, his tanks were more heavily armoured, they had larger calibre guns with nearly twice the effective range of ours, and their telescopes were superior. 5 RTR 19/11/41

The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle 1941/42

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Leo Niehorster
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Re: German army at Don

Post by Leo Niehorster » 22 Feb 2012 20:05

I was indeed incorrect. See maps below. The Axis front lines were along the west side of the Don River.

Cheers
Leo
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tigre
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Re: German army at Don

Post by tigre » 23 Feb 2012 03:12

Hello to all :D; you're welcome Auceps. Leo the 79 ID and the 294 marched by Kantemirowka during the summer offensive of 1942 (Unternehmen Blau)............About your maps: all of them are right, being the first after the Soviet winter offensive..........

15.12.1942 A batalion of IR 539 (385.ID) is at Orobinski. At 14.30 it is at disposal of Cosseria. At 20.30 hours the 385.ID with the units already arrived (IR 537 and IR 539) is formally subordinated to II army corps. The IR 538 is not yet arrived and is replaced by 14.Pol.Rgt. (his arrival is announced).

16.12.1942 Div. CP (298 ID) at Bogutschar. Heavy russian attack on Division "Ravenna" (left of 298.Inf.Div.). Local enemy attacks at Division "Pasubio" (right to 298.Inf.Div.).In the evening Division "Ravenna" is put under command of 298.Inf.Div.. 298.Inf.Div. changes from XXXV.A.K. to II.ital.A.K.

17.12.1942 Div. CP (298 ID) moves to Radshenskoje. part of the forces of Ravenna (Capizzi group, made mainly by troops of 37 inf. Regt) were separated from the corps, because it [Capizzi group] had moved towards south-east and joined 298 german inf div at Certkovo.

18.12.1942 Div. CP (298 ID) moves to Malewanny. 387.ID is unloaded from trains north of Kantemirovka.

19.12.1942 15:00 Div. CP (298 ID) moves from Malewanny to Bogunoff. The regiments received order from Malewanny by radio to withdraw from the enemy after sunset, march south through the enemy free gap between Medowa – group of houses 6 km east of it in order to reach the Tichaja-sector and build defenses there. On December 19 most of the Ravenna and the 90 Art Regt (Cosseria) flew in disorder from Kantemirovka.
Most of the Cosseria Division had been regrouped at Sofjevka, west of the railway Rossosc-Millerovo, while remnants of the 89 inf. Regt (which remained in the line till December 20) were regrouped behind the Cuneense division.

On this day the Soviet armored wedges (17 Armoured Corps) reached the depth of the Italian rearguard, occupied Kantemirovka (major Italian logistics center) and also fought in Chertkovo deep in the rear of the XXIV Pz Korps.

Sources: Kriegstagebuch 298.Inf.Div.
http://www.comandosupremo.com/forums/to ... entry69133
http://www.comandosupremo.com/forums/to ... entry71420

Cheers. Raúl M 8-).
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Leo Niehorster
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Re: German army at Don

Post by Leo Niehorster » 23 Feb 2012 09:18

Thanks for the maps and text, Tigre. Thought I had been wrong in indicating the Italians' positions. So the Soviet 18 December 1942 offensive against the southern portion of the Eighth Italian Army explains the front lines as per my map of 11 January 1943, when the Soviet Voroneš Front attacked Army Group Center. 8-)

Cheers
Leo

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Re: German army at Don

Post by Auceps » 23 Feb 2012 19:59

Thank you again, guys!
Btw., a few more questions:
Did SS-Brigade Schuldt reached Kantemirovka in December 1942 or not?
Maybe somebody have any photos of Germans in Kantemirovka in 1942? :)

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tigre
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Re: German army at Don

Post by tigre » 24 Feb 2012 04:21

Hello to all :D; do not mention it Leo and thanks for your complement as well :wink:. Cheers. Raúl M 8-).

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