Panzer-Ersatz-Abteilung 100

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panzerman1984
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Panzer-Ersatz-Abteilung 100

Post by panzerman1984 » 16 Apr 2012 22:14

Hello,
I'm trying to find more info on a photo I had acquired a while ago. While looking into Panzer-Ersatz-Abteilung 100, I noticed that my photo stated a 4th Kompanie. Now, when I use online sources, I find that the Abteilung only had 3 Kompanies plus a Staff kompanie.

Is it possible that they counted the Staff kompanie as 4th kmp, and this is what the photo shows ?? Thanks for any help!


1 Source showing only 3 kmp's: http://www.lexikon-der-wehrmacht.de/Gli ... s100-R.htm


P.S.- I do have a photo showing a Hotchkiss H39 #225 from this unit, while there was a Hotchkiss #224 that was KO'd at La Fiere Bridge. I wonder if there is any relation, but without a date, Im sure its almost impossible to tell...
Let me know if anyone is interested in seeing that pic.
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jpz4
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Re: Panzer-Ersatz-Abteilung 100

Post by jpz4 » 16 Apr 2012 23:30

Hi Panzerman, you sure got my attention. (You may already have found my articles on Missing-Lynx?) And of course I'd be interested in seeing that photo.

Any way, as for your question:
At D-Day (or rather in the reports of May 1944) the battalion had three companies, however by then it had already lost much if its former glory. As you probably have read the battalion was raised in April 1941 and at that time there was much more reason to train guys to operate French tanks. If you look at the history of the battalion (Panzer Tracts 19-1), the number of transfers (of entire companies) from the battalion to other formations were quite numerous. Therefor it seem highly likely the battalion had four and possibly even more companies at its peak (probably the 1941-early 1943 period).
Photos from Panzer Tracts show the 2nd kompanie at one point had 4 platoons, and I see no reason why that wouldn't be the same for the other kompanies (unless there where transfers). In Normandy the companies had just three platoons and only the 2nd was fully equipped with tanks. At least it is clear the battalion was not a big as it used to be.

I can't give you the details from the top of my head, but what is also relevant is the fact that at some point the battalion was split into an Ersatz Abteilung and an Ausbildungs Abteiling, but this was later revoked. Because the sign on your photo says Pz.Ers.Abt.100 it must have been taken during that period. IIRC I think this all happened in 1943, but like I said I'd really need to check to be sure.

To summarize all this:
- It is very likely the battalion did have four (or even more) companies in the earlier years of the war, but by 1944 there wasn't much left.
- Your photo was probably taken when the battalion was split up into two battalion, or shortly after. That should give an approximate date for the photo.

There's a lot more I can tell about the battalion, just send me a PM if your interested.

Niels

panzerman1984
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Re: Panzer-Ersatz-Abteilung 100

Post by panzerman1984 » 17 Apr 2012 02:39

Hi Niels!
A pleasent surprise to see your reply. I most certainly have fully read your incredible study on Missing-Lynx numerous times! haha
As a matter of fact, I am in the midst of reading Bob Murphy's book "No Better Place to Die", as you had reccomended. A great first hand account of the battle so far, in my opinion.

I thank you for your information on other existing kompanies. I had a feeling that 3 kompanies seemed a bit small, especially at
their prime-time. But I have seen numerous online sources, continually showing only 3 kmp's.....but as usual, they are probably just copied off of each other! This is why I felt it necessary to ask someone with more knowledge of the structure of this interesting Abteilung. I do know the history/etc of the unit, but have found very little in the way of reference material. I'm glad that you have given me a estimated date of the photo, as I was thinking it was a bit earlier....so thanks again!


Here is the other photo that was supposedly from Pz Ersatz Abteilung 100, as I was told.
I have other photos of this man, earlier and later....but he had transferred units later in the war, judging by all of the photos.
As you can see, there is a Hotchkiss H39, with #225 ?
Like I said, Im not 100% sure if it even has anything to do with all of this, but it might be worth a look at the very least.
From the photos I have, I cant even be 100% sure that this is positively Pz Ers Abt 100, but was given this info at time of one of the last photo purchases of the group....so I am assuming they are as stated. Thanks for looking, either way!
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Re: Panzer-Ersatz-Abteilung 100

Post by jpz4 » 17 Apr 2012 09:13

Great photo, seems to be similar to the examples in Panzer Tracts. Send me an email (for address see ML articles) and I'll send you some proper scans. It is noteworthy this H39 has a short barrel, something the battalion's eight H39s in Normandy probably did not have. However it has been recorded Pz.Abt.206 had such guns.

BTW I tried to find the source of the information about the name-change/splitting up of the battalion. No luck yet, so at this point I tend to follow the information on Lexikon der Wehrmacht. Regardless if the battalion was split up, it seems the battalion got its final name in April '43. That would place your photos before that date.

Niels

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Re: Panzer-Ersatz-Abteilung 100

Post by Alanmccoubrey » 17 Apr 2012 12:16

Alan

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Re: Panzer-Ersatz-Abteilung 100

Post by panzerman1984 » 18 Apr 2012 00:09

Niels,
Thanks for having a look. Excellent point about the small barrel. Panzer Abt. 206 could be a possibility, and I will have to take a closer look at the other photos from this small group.
Also, thanks for looking into the dates......which can confirm a rough date of my photo, before the name change. Email being sent!


Alan, thanks for looking. Yes, Niels (the member posting above), was the one who did the amazing work. Its too bad people havent followed suite for other battles.
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Re: Panzer-Ersatz-Abteilung 100

Post by panzerman1984 » 18 Apr 2012 00:14

couple randoms of the same guy
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Re: Panzer-Ersatz-Abteilung 100

Post by panzerman1984 » 18 Apr 2012 00:20

stepping up, earning the PAB etc
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Re: Panzer-Ersatz-Abteilung 100

Post by hero. » 25 Apr 2012 22:57

Hello Niels and Panzerman !

I really appreciate the very detailed interest in this Ersatzheer unit of both of you,
and especially the excellent postings on Missing-Lynx !

I cannot help you with any details on individual tanks or the fighting after D-Day.
My main interest is the Ersatzheer and its units, but perhaps some of the following
general info can be of help in your research.

Until November 1942, an Ersatz-unit had the task to train new recruits (in one or more Ausbildungs-Kp.),
but also to take care of the wounded or ill soldiers, until they were fit for frontline duty again.
The latter would happen in one (or more) Genesenden-Kp. If enough personnel had accumulated,
a Marsch-Kp. would be formed, with which those men could be sent to the front again.

In November 1942, a major organizational change was ordered and almost all Ersatz-battalions were split
into an Ausbildungs- (training-) and an Ersatz- (replacement-) battalion with the same number.

The idea was to move the training battalions to the occupied territories and to combine training
with security duties there, to relieve several occupation divisions from this tasks, so that they
could be sent to the front.
(Those training-battalions outside the ZOI usually were redesignated with the term Reserve-... .)


The Ersatz-battalion, usually remained in the ZOI and did most of the
administrative paperwork for both units and also took care of the Genesenden.

A typical setup of an Ersatz-Btl. would be : 1 Stamm-, 1 Genesenden- and 1 Marsch-Kp.
A typical setup for an (infantry) Ausbildungs-Btl. would be 3 Schützen-Kp. and one MG-Kp (all for training).

However, in contrast to the very regular Gliederung of field-infantry, field-artillery etc. battalions
the number of companies in both types of Ersatzheer-battalions would simply depend on how much personnel
was to be trained, cured, etc. ...
So there was a great variety, in the numbers of companies in battalions of the same type.
=> On the other hand, also the number of companies within each given battalion usually could change several times.
-------------------

Now to the Pz.-EuA-Btl. 100 :
According to the Gliederung displayed in Lexikon der Wehrmacht :
Only units outside the ZOI did receive FPN. So the FPN entry for Pz.EuA-Abt. 100 was made around April, 1942,
when the unit was transferred to Versailles. At that time, it should have 3 companies. (As long as the FPN itself
was not changed, no change in the Feldpost-Übersicht would be made, regardless how many companies the Abteilung
had at different times. The capital letters behind the FPN were only a help when sorting the letters, but the
mail would go to the right unit without them.)

I have attached 2 scans for the Gliederung of Pz.-EuA-Abt. 100 for an overview on the Gliederung :
Mid_April 1942_____ : 3 companies, type unknown
Mid_November 1942_: 4 companies, 1 of them a Genesenden-Kp.
End_December 1943_: 5 companies, 1 Stamm-, 1 Gen.-, 3 Ausbildungs-Kp.

As you see on the scan, while the Pz.Ersatz-Abt. 204 Schwetzingen, was split in November 1942, as I described above,
the Pz.Ersatz.Abt. 100 was not (perhaps because it was already located outside the ZOI ?!).
Instead it was renamed in April 1943 to Panzer-Ersatz- und Ausbildungs-Abteilung 100, but probably without any changes in the Gliederung. This designation remained until July 1944.(From this, the photo should be made before April 1943)

I also attach a scan of the Gliederung of the Abteilung on 18.5.1944, which displays the 3 companies and the strength
that Zetterling refers to. (Source: KTB 7.Armee, T312, R1566)

In my opinion, those 3 companies could be either those 3 training companies, that were already present in
November 1943, which had then been moved nearer to the front to combine their training with some security tasks.
Or Pz.EuA-Abt. 100 had formed an Alarm-unit, which was already a dedicated fighting unit, to strengthen the defence
against the upcoming allied invasion.

In both cases, at least the Stamm-Kp. at Versailles would still be present (on the Genesenden-Kp. we don't know),
as the Pz.-EuA-Abt. 100 as a whole was not dissolved before July, 1944 (see below).
----------------------

Maybe the following is of interest, too. The handwriting on the Nov. 1943 Gliederung says :
At the top : Gemäss Antrag Ob. West wurden aus der ehemaligen Ers. u. Ausb.Abt. 100 etatisiert :
(On request by Ob. West the follwowing units of former Pz.EuA 100 are "etatisiert" :
[I lack a proper translation for : etatisiert] )(basically, it means that they are now part of the field army
and that replacements, material etc. can be requested for them)

- 1 le. Pz.Kp. für Pz.Grp. Kdo. West
- 1 Sich.[erungs] Kp. für Pz.Grp. Kdo. West
- 1 gek.[ürzte] Pz. Eins.[atz ?] Kp. (als 4. gem.[ischte] Pz.Aufkl.Abt. 520)
( I/7569 g. v. 17.7.44 )

Next to Pz.EuA-Abt. 100 it says :
Aufgelöst durch Ob. West u. freiwerdendes Pers.[onal ?] u. Mat.[erial ?] zur Verfügung Ob.West
( Dissolved by Ob.West. Personnel and material are at the disposal of Ob. West )
( I/6920 g. v. 1.7.1944)
Restpersonal durch Ob. West für Auffüllung der 1. gem.[ischten] Pz.Aufkl.Abt. 520 (H.Tr.) verwendet [?].
( The remaing personnel had been used by Ob.West to fill up 1. gem. Pz.Aufkl.Abt. 520 (H.Tr.) ).
( I/7618 g. v. 16.7.44)

Perhaps someone can read the words with questionmarks better ?!
I hope this information is of some use for your research :D !

Best regards,

hero.
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jpz4
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Re: Panzer-Ersatz-Abteilung 100

Post by jpz4 » 28 Apr 2012 00:14

Hi Hero, thanks a lot for the additional information. Really helps to put some things in perspective. I did find bit and pieces here and there but your explanation makes a lot more sense. There are a few interesting questions surrounding the battalion and maybe I'll get back to those later.

And to finish, thanks for taking the time to upload those documents. Never seen number one and two.

Niels

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Re: Panzer-Ersatz-Abteilung 100

Post by Zambone » 20 May 2021 11:25

Hi there! I’m searching for informations for my grandpas company and history!
We have some photos with something written behind.
On one in remember of 41 he was in Russia
And the company name was:
6. pz Ersatz Abteilung 100
Ithink he mixed something ...
The panzerregiment 22 had 8 companies
I know that the panzer Abteilung 100 changed in panzerregiment 100 and than panzerregiment 22
If that’s how I think he should have been under Hauptmann Fromm- fürchtinger and the commander was Martin vierzig ..
On other photos he wrote Carentan 44 , richeville -
Than two more times richeville ..( what the hell was in richeville)
Than 25.05.44 caen training day with my panzer IV
And later he crossed a river running away ( that should have been the Elbe or oder that told my grandma... in 45
Does anybody can help me?
Have some photos for more informations
Thanks

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Re: Panzer-Ersatz-Abteilung 100

Post by Sam Wren » 20 May 2021 18:00

Welcome to the Forum Zambone.

Panzer-Regiment 100 (redesignated Panzer-Regiment 22 just before D-Day) and Panzer-E.u.A.-Abt. 100 were two totally different units. Pz.Rgt. 100/22 was an independent unit that was later incorporated into 21.Panzer-Division. I am no expert but I have been studying this unit for quite some time and may be able to answer your questions, but you should probably start a new thread since this thread is for a different unit.

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Re: Panzer-Ersatz-Abteilung 100

Post by K.Kocjancic » 21 May 2021 05:58

hero. wrote:
25 Apr 2012 22:57
Hello Niels and Panzerman !

In November 1942, a major organizational change was ordered and almost all Ersatz-battalions were split
into an Ausbildungs- (training-) and an Ersatz- (replacement-) battalion with the same number.

The idea was to move the training battalions to the occupied territories and to combine training
with security duties there, to relieve several occupation divisions from this tasks, so that they
could be sent to the front.
(Those training-battalions outside the ZOI usually were redesignated with the term Reserve-... .)
Hi!

Do you perhaps have a source for this directive/order?

Regards,
Klemen

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Re: Panzer-Ersatz-Abteilung 100

Post by Der Rittmeister » 31 May 2021 19:30

panzerman1984 wrote:
17 Apr 2012 02:39
Hi Niels!
A pleasent surprise to see your reply. I most certainly have fully read your incredible study on Missing-Lynx numerous times! haha
As a matter of fact, I am in the midst of reading Bob Murphy's book "No Better Place to Die", as you had reccomended. A great first hand account of the battle so far, in my opinion.

I thank you for your information on other existing kompanies. I had a feeling that 3 kompanies seemed a bit small, especially at
their prime-time. But I have seen numerous online sources, continually showing only 3 kmp's.....but as usual, they are probably just copied off of each other! This is why I felt it necessary to ask someone with more knowledge of the structure of this interesting Abteilung. I do know the history/etc of the unit, but have found very little in the way of reference material. I'm glad that you have given me a estimated date of the photo, as I was thinking it was a bit earlier....so thanks again!


Here is the other photo that was supposedly from Pz Ersatz Abteilung 100, as I was told.
I have other photos of this man, earlier and later....but he had transferred units later in the war, judging by all of the photos.
As you can see, there is a Hotchkiss H39, with #225 ?
Like I said, Im not 100% sure if it even has anything to do with all of this, but it might be worth a look at the very least.
From the photos I have, I cant even be 100% sure that this is positively Pz Ers Abt 100, but was given this info at time of one of the last photo purchases of the group....so I am assuming they are as stated. Thanks for looking, either way!
I don't want to dash this thread but what more info do you have about this crewman? Would be very interesting to know!

Cheers! :thumbsup:

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