German High Commanders of WW2

Discussions on the personalities of the Wehrmacht and of the organizations not covered in the other sections. Hosted by Dieter Zinke, askropp and Frech.
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Jeremy Dixon
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Re: German army commanders of WW2

Post by Jeremy Dixon » 20 Oct 2018 20:39

Fretter-Pico was deputy commander?

histan
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Re: German army commanders of WW2

Post by histan » 20 Oct 2018 23:55

Hi Jeremy

Fretter-Pico was standing in for von Mackensen while the latter was away on leave - deputizing for him if you like.

There was no job with the title "Deputy Commander in Chief"

Regards

John

Rossano
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Re: German army commanders of WW2

Post by Rossano » 21 Oct 2018 08:26

Hello, very interesting
In Johns' s previous docs. Fretter-Pico is foreseen (after having stood in for Mackensen) to enter his holiday from 12.5.43 and Eberhardt being his deputy from the same day.
Was this date later for both confirmed ? Did v. Mackensen return on 12.5.43 too (or before or later) ? Also, who stood in for Fretter-Pico from april 43 (maybe Eberhardt again already or who ?) and from when exactly ?
Many thanks

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askropp
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Re: German army commanders of WW2

Post by askropp » 23 Oct 2018 17:49

20. Gebirgsarmee
20.06.1942 – 23.06.1944 Generaloberst Eduard Dietl
24.06.1944 – 23.01.1945 Generaloberst Lothar Rendulic
23.01.1945 – 08.05.1945 General der Gebirgstruppe Franz Böhme
Er ist wieder da. Aber auch dieses Mal wird er nicht siegen!

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askropp
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Re: German army commanders of WW2

Post by askropp » 28 Oct 2018 16:52

21. Armee
25.04.1945 - 02.05.1945 General der Infanterie Kurt von Tippelskirch (mFb)

This follows the Generalskartei which says that Tippelskirch retained his command while he was mstFb HGr Weichsel on 30 April and 1 May. In my notes, I also found a claim of Felix Steiner mstFb AOK 21 during that period, but I can't remember the source.
Er ist wieder da. Aber auch dieses Mal wird er nicht siegen!

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askropp
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Re: German army commanders of WW2

Post by askropp » 31 Oct 2018 14:07

24. Armee
xx.12.1944 – 06.05.1945 General der Infanterie z.V. Hans Schmidt

So far, I have not been able to find out on which day Erkundungsstab Donaueschingen was renamed AOK 24.
Er ist wieder da. Aber auch dieses Mal wird er nicht siegen!

Rossano
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Re: German army commanders of WW2

Post by Rossano » 31 Oct 2018 14:53

Hello Askropp
According to some sources not Hans but Rudolf (Gen.Ob.) was OB AOK 24
Rgds., Rossano

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askropp
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Re: German army commanders of WW2

Post by askropp » 31 Oct 2018 15:33

Dear Rossano, I don't know what "some sources" are, but I know that they must be pure bullshit if they claim such a nonsense. Rudolf Schmidt was fired by Hitler in 1943, and he was lucky not to be hanged for defeatism. Hitler hated him and prevented several efforts by Schmundt and Burgdorf to have him reactivated. Rudolf Schmidt was in Weimar in April 1945, not in Austria. Hans Schmidt's service as Kommandant der Befestigungen Vogesen, Befehlshaber des Erkundungsstabes Donaueschingen and OB 24. Armee is well documented, not least by his own essays for the Foreign Military Studies series (B-102 & B-103). De Lattre blamed him for surrendering to the Americans instead to his 1st French Army.

Regards,
Albert
Er ist wieder da. Aber auch dieses Mal wird er nicht siegen!

Rossano
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Re: German army commanders of WW2

Post by Rossano » 31 Oct 2018 16:28

Well Albert
It all sounds pretty well documented..........
I based my note on sources like Keilig, like Wegmann/Zweng and even like v. Siegler (and maybe Tessin too..), all stating that Gen.Ob. Rud. Schmidt was OB. AOK 24 (which would have sense, I mean as a Gen.Ob. leading an Armee, whilst H. Schmidt was Gen.d.Inf.) and also stating that Hans Schmidt' s Mob. Verw. was aufgehoben on 31.10.43. Was he later reintegrated ? Are all sources wrong ???
Rgds., Rossano

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askropp
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Re: German army commanders of WW2

Post by askropp » 31 Oct 2018 17:15

Au contraire, Rudolf Schmidt would make NOT any sense at all, because AOK 24 was subordinated to AOK 19 which was subordinated to HGr G, and both were commanded by generals. Does anybody believe that a Generaloberst would serve under two junior officers? Those guys don't know anything about Hitler if they believe he would forgive Schmidt, whose brother was a French spy who committed suicide in a Gestapo prison in 1943! By the way, Hans Schmidt's Mobilmachungsverwendung was aufgehoben on 31.01.1944. This did not stop some clowns from believing he became KG stv. V. AK after 20 July, which he did not, of course. He was recalled to service on 8 August as Befehlshaber des Erkundungsstabes Vogesen (and Kommandant der Befestigungen Vogesen after 22 September). Keilig, who wrote in the 1950s, is riddled with errors and nearly useless for present-day studies.
Er ist wieder da. Aber auch dieses Mal wird er nicht siegen!

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Re: German army commanders of WW2

Post by Rossano » 04 Nov 2018 07:22

Hello Albert, sorry for the late reply
I agree with You, Keilig is not so reliable, but strange that Wegmann/Zweng, v.Siegler and even Tessin made the same error.........
By the way, Tessin (wrongly ?) reports that the "Kdtr. d. Befest. Vogesen" was renamed about sept./oct. 44 in Höh.Kdo. Vogesen, whilst another source (correctly ?) reports that not the Kdtr. Befest. Vogesen but the Höh.Kdo. Oberrhein was renamed in Höh.Kdo. Vogesen.
So, until when did H. Schmidt command the Kdtr. d. Befest. Vogesen, and also, from when did he command the Erk.St. Donaueschingen ?
Many thanks, Rossano

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askropp
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Re: German army commanders of WW2

Post by askropp » 04 Nov 2018 17:09

I have no other dates than those already posted here.
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Re: German army commanders of WW2

Post by askropp » 28 Nov 2018 18:09

25. Armee
10.11.1944 – 28.01.1945 General der Flieger Friedrich Christiansen
29.01.1945 – 27.03.1945 General der Infanterie Günther Blumentritt (mFb)
27.03.1945 – 07.04.1945 General der Kavallerie Philipp Kleffel (mstFb)
07.04.1945 – 05.05.1945 Generaloberst Johannes Blaskowitz

With Blaskowitz' takeover, AOK 25 was to become OB Niederlande. There are some indications that Blaskowitz did not arrive and Kleffel may have continued in command until 15/16 April. Who knows more?
Er ist wieder da. Aber auch dieses Mal wird er nicht siegen!

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Re: German army commanders of WW2

Post by askropp » 07 Dec 2018 19:00

Meanwhile, there are only the named (not numbered) AOKs left.
Note that late war ad hoc formations named after their commander (Blumentritt, Lindemann, Müller) are not included.

AOK Norwegen
19.12.1940 - 07.01.1945 Generaloberst Nikolaus von Falkenhorst
Later incorporated into GebAOK 20.

Panzergruppe Afrika
22.01.1942 renamed Panzerarmee Afrika
25.10.1942 renamed Deutsch-italienische Panzerarmee
20.02.1943 renamed 1a Armata
15.08.1941 – 01.11.1941 General der Panzertruppe Erwin Rommel
01.11.1941 – 18.11.1941 Generalleutnant Ludwig Crüwell (mstFb)
18.11.1941 – 09.03.1942 General der Panzertruppe (30.01.1942 Generaloberst) Erwin Rommel
09.03.1942 – 19.03.1942 General der Panzertruppe Ludwig Crüwell (mstFb)
19.03.1942 – 22.09.1942 Generaloberst (22.06.1942 Generalfeldmarschall) Erwin Rommel
22.09.1942 – 24.10.1942 General der Panzertruppe Georg Stumme (mstFb)
24.10.1942 – 25.10.1942 Generalleutnant Wilhelm Ritter von Thoma (mstFb)
25.10.1942 – 27.11.1942 Generalfeldmarschall Erwin Rommel
27.11.1942 – 02.12.1942 General der Panzertruppe Gustav Fehn (mstFb)
02.12.1942 – 20.02.1943 Generalfeldmarschall Erwin Rommel
20.02.1943 – 13.05.1943 Generale d’Armata (12.05.1943 Maresciallo d’Italia) Giovanni Messe

AOK Lappland
15.01.1942 - 20.06.1942 General der Gebirgstruppe (01.06.1942 Generaloberst) Eduard Dietl
Later renamed GebAOK 20.

AOK Ligurien
31.07.1944 - 27.04.1945 Maresciallo d'Italia Rodolfo Graziani
27.04.1945 - 29.04.1945 Generalleutnant Max-Josef Pemsel (mstFb)
Pemsel was not officially beauftragt, but he was the ranking officer for the two days until his own capture.

AOK Ostpreußen
10.04.1945 - 09.05.1945 General der Panzertruppe Dietrich von Saucken (mFb)
Er ist wieder da. Aber auch dieses Mal wird er nicht siegen!

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Re: German army commanders of WW2

Post by askropp » 09 Dec 2018 16:30

On PzAOK 4:

Someone must have commanded after Harpe took over the HGr in June 1944, even if he retained nominal command. Nehring did not arrive until 2 July. My working assumption is that the Chef, Oberst Schulze-Büttger, was beauftragt mit der Wahrnehmung der laufenden Geschäfte.

On 15 September, Balck went on leave never to return, and Hermann Recknagel was mstFb (KTB). In fact, Balck was still exercising control through frequent phone calls with his Chef Mellenthin. On 20 September, Mellenthin left to follow Balck west and Gräser arrived.
Er ist wieder da. Aber auch dieses Mal wird er nicht siegen!

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