200,000? Ethnic Germans from eastern europe deported to USSR

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wildboar
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200,000? Ethnic Germans from eastern europe deported to USSR

Post by wildboar » 20 May 2003 18:36

It is known fact that Stalin and Beria were responsible for mass deportation and expulsion of ethnic germans from eastern europe.
It was they who set in motion the massive anti german frenzy in eastern europe .

Nearly 170,000 ethnic germans were deported to germany from Yugoslavia and Romania
But another 200,000 ethnic germans of those left behind from Hungary, Yugoslavia, Romania were sent to Russia

Source-
http://pubs.socialistreviewindex.org.uk ... endix2.htm

The website given above has good and excellent information in table form of FORCED MIGRATIONS IN THE 20TH CENTURY BALKANS

Considering the information quoted in the web-site the million dollar question remain what happened to those 200,000 ethnic germans who were deported to soviet union?

The fact may be that all the 200,000 Germans deported to USSR were sent to Gulag Slave Labour Camps Located in Siberia and they perished there.

The deportation of 200,000 ethnic germans from eastern europe to ussr was crime against humanity commited by stalin and beria .

will history ever recognise crime against humanity commited by stalin and beria ?

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Post by Pr. Reinhard » 20 May 2003 20:10

Thank you for this information wildboar!

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Roberto
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Re: 200,000? Ethnic Germans from eastern europe deported to

Post by Roberto » 20 May 2003 21:23

wildboar wrote: will history ever recognise crime against humanity commited by stalin and beria ?
Either I'm over-optimistic, or history has already done so and sees Stalin as one of the three greatest murderers of the 20th Century, or even of recorded history.

A short comparative assessment of the big three can be found under the following link:

http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/tyrants.htm

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Benoit Douville
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Post by Benoit Douville » 21 May 2003 01:38

It has been about 60 years now since World War II is over so it is very close if we consider history on a long period of time. Maybe in some years from now Russia will recognized their crimes against the German population. We can only hope.
Last edited by Benoit Douville on 21 May 2003 23:09, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 200,000? Ethnic Germans from eastern europe deported to

Post by Xserx » 21 May 2003 15:39

wildboar wrote: The fact may be that all the 200,000 Germans deported to USSR were sent to Gulag Slave Labour Camps Located in Siberia and they perished there.
O'k. If you really interesting this theme - look next link: http://www.thirdreichforum.com/viewtopi ... highlight= . I'm write about Germany POW's, but about volksdeutche too. Volksdeutche was deported in GUPVI camps, not GULAG. I have some information about this theme - if you interesting, write to me.
Xserx/

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wildboar
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Re: 200,000? Ethnic Germans from eastern europe deported to

Post by wildboar » 21 May 2003 17:16

Xserx wrote:
wildboar wrote: The fact may be that all the 200,000 Germans deported to USSR were sent to Gulag Slave Labour Camps Located in Siberia and they perished there.
O'k. If you really interesting this theme - look next link: http://www.thirdreichforum.com/viewtopi ... highlight= . I'm write about Germany POW's, but about volksdeutche too. Volksdeutche was deported in GUPVI camps, not GULAG. I have some information about this theme - if you interesting, write to me.
Xserx/
Xserx

Yes i am interested in information can you present it onboard.

What is difference between GUPVI and GULAG ?
Did the namesake difference made any difference in treatment of germans?

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Re: 200,000? Ethnic Germans from eastern europe deported to

Post by POW » 21 May 2003 17:44

wildboar wrote:It is known fact that Stalin and Beria were responsible for mass deportation and expulsion of ethnic germans from eastern europe.
Well, so far I can remember the expulsion was called "population transfer" and not just Stalin bust the western Allies agreed also.

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wildboar
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Re: 200,000? Ethnic Germans from eastern europe deported to

Post by wildboar » 21 May 2003 18:21

POW wrote:
wildboar wrote:It is known fact that Stalin and Beria were responsible for mass deportation and expulsion of ethnic germans from eastern europe.
Well, so far I can remember the expulsion was called "population transfer" and not just Stalin bust the western Allies agreed also.
Pow it cant' be termed as population transfer as western allies had no option to agree to stalin and beria's demand as the red army controlled whole of eastern europe.

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Re: 200,000? Ethnic Germans from eastern europe deported to

Post by Roberto » 21 May 2003 23:08

wildboar wrote:
POW wrote:
wildboar wrote:It is known fact that Stalin and Beria were responsible for mass deportation and expulsion of ethnic germans from eastern europe.
Well, so far I can remember the expulsion was called "population transfer" and not just Stalin bust the western Allies agreed also.
Pow it cant' be termed as population transfer as western allies had no option to agree to stalin and beria's demand as the red army controlled whole of eastern europe.
In what terms exactly did wildboar's old friend Beria voice the demand?

Or did he just whisper in Uncle Joe's ear?

In the latter case, can wildboar show us some evidence suggesting Beria's influence on Stalin in this matter?

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Re: 200,000? Ethnic Germans from eastern europe deported to

Post by Xserx » 22 May 2003 20:12

wildboar wrote: What is difference between GUPVI and GULAG ?
Did the namesake difference made any difference in treatment of germans?
O'k, wildboar. GUPVI(Central administrative board on affairs POW's and DP) was a special system camps for POW's and Displaced Persons (DP), GULAG (Central administrative board of camps) intended for political opponents of system and criminals. But GUPVI and GULAG was in the system NKVD. I think, that no real difference between GULAG and GUPVI in relation to the prisoners. In both systems work of prisoners in various areas was widely applied. But masses of volksdeutce was in system GUPVI. I shall place more detailed information in this place tomorrow in the evening. If I have correctly understood, you are interested in destiny volksdeutce. In the following message I shall try to concentrate in this question. By quantity POW's and DP you will find some information on that link which I has specified in the previous message.
P.S.:The policy of use of work of Germans (and volksdeutce too) after war on restoration of economy of the USSR was not idea of Beria or Stalin, but the basic moment in the USSR policy on the negotiations with Allies.
Xserx/

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Xserx
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Post by Xserx » 23 May 2003 14:30

As well as promised, the information about volksdeutche. According to statistical to report NKVD USSR from July, 15 1950, the general number "mobilized and interned" volksdeutche has made 271672 (earlier report made at the end of 1945 speaks about 189572 volksdeutche from which 51138 - women). From them were repatriated 202720 person. Thus, death rate made 25,4%. But it is necessary to take into account, that the data do not enter into the given statistics about died on a way to jails which there was a significant amount.
Distribution interned volksdeutche on the countries (March 1946):

Country.............Man's..........Woman's

Germany..............27154............11527
Hungary...............15334.............9109
Romania...............26266.............27680
Yougoslavia...........2883...............6093
Poland...................2048................417
Czhehoslovakia......584..................138
Austria...................82.....................16

Authorities of the countries of the East Europe (especially Romania) actively cooperated with the Soviet authorities in business of internment volksdeutche.
From interned volksdeutche separate working battalions which worked on restoration of economy of the USSR were created.
Write to me if your interest is kept. I have still information on this theme.

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Post by David Thompson » 23 May 2003 16:26

Xserx -- I think the information you've posted is both interesting and valuable. Please post most if you have it.

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Xserx
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Post by Xserx » 23 May 2003 18:20

O'k, David and all.
In the territories occupied by USSR, the order on mobilization volksdeutche should be informed individually under beforehand made lists. In settlements where the German population made the majority, the order was disclosed at special assembly, and this settlement was surrounded by military units. Standard the requirement was: "to have clothes, bedding, the foodstuffs for 15 days, but no more than 200 kg"
The opportunity of use volksdeutche on restoration of economy of the USSR was made in the special report of the Yalta conference on development of reparation requirements, which including provided: "... Use of work of the mobilized Germans"
Exellent source: "Im Archipel GUPVI. Kriegsgefangenshaft und internierung in der Sowjetunion 1941-1956" by Stefan Karner ISBN(?. May be only Russian) 5-7281-0424-X. This book has left at support of teachers of my university (the Russian State Humanitarian University).
I have some photos, but I not have scaner :cry:
Xserx/

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Re: 200,000? Ethnic Germans from eastern europe deported to

Post by wildboar » 24 May 2003 16:25

Xserx wrote:
wildboar wrote: P.S.:The policy of use of work of Germans (and volksdeutce too) after war on restoration of economy of the USSR was not idea of Beria or Stalin, but the basic moment in the USSR policy on the negotiations with Allies.
Xserx/

Xserx
Thanks for your explanation on difference between GUPVI and GULAG ,but since both were controlled by monster organisation NVKD headed by devil named Beria there was no difference between same but it was attempt on part of communist pary to fool world opinion

Xserx
What is your source
for was not idea of Beria or Stalin, but the basic moment in the USSR policy on the negotiations
Infact the entire idea was of monsters named stalin and beria and nothing to do with Soviet Unions Policy.

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wildboar
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Re-information

Post by wildboar » 24 May 2003 16:28

Xserx wrote:As well as promised, the information about volksdeutche. According to statistical to report NKVD USSR from July, 15 1950, the general number "mobilized and interned" volksdeutche has made 271672 (earlier report made at the end of 1945 speaks about 189572 volksdeutche from which 51138 - women). From them were repatriated 202720 person. Thus, death rate made 25,4%. But it is necessary to take into account, that the data do not enter into the given statistics about died on a way to jails which there was a significant amount.
Distribution interned volksdeutche on the countries (March 1946):

Country.............Man's..........Woman's

Germany..............27154............11527
Hungary...............15334.............9109
Romania...............26266.............27680
Yougoslavia...........2883...............6093
Poland...................2048................417
Czhehoslovakia......584..................138
Austria...................82.....................16

Authorities of the countries of the East Europe (especially Romania) actively cooperated with the Soviet authorities in business of internment volksdeutche.
From interned volksdeutche separate working battalions which worked on restoration of economy of the USSR were created.
Write to me if your interest is kept. I have still information on this theme.
Xserx
Thanks for good information .
Can you provide some more detailed information please ?

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