SA marschiert (Im Sachsenland marschieren wir...)

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SA marschiert (Im Sachsenland marschieren wir...)

Post by Ivan Ž. » 01 Jun 2015 14:03

[Split from Review your 78 rpm records]
Telefunken wrote:Me and Michail actually were talking about what version it was earlier! Unfortunately for me thats one of my least favorite versions of it, BUT! its still SA marschiert, and I still love it! I should explain better, I understand that it isn't a super rare record, but I have a certain draw to that particular march, I've never really understood why, perhaps its the articulation of the lyrics or the powerful message, or perhaps its the fact that I have not been able to obtain a copy and its become one of those "Want because I can't have" things, but it is absolutely one of my favorites, (its so hard to have just one with this hobby) especially when it comes to more propaganda-like music.
Hello, Alex

Regarding "SA marschiert": well it is understandable you are drawn to it, as you say, it is an incredibly catchy tune, which is still sang today in Germany (go for example to a Borussia Dortmund match). There are many recordings of the SA variant of this tune; I personally do not collect political records (I do have some though), but most are known to me nevertheless. My recommendation to you would be to search for Grammophon recordings of the song, by Engel's band ("Durch deutsches Land..." it's the one with stomping boots; they also recorded "Durch Groß-Berlin..." version, not as effective) and by Ewers' band ("Im Schlesierland..." an enthusiastic, a bit faster or let's call it "jumpy" version). These two are the best I've heard. I also liked the communist shawm cover of the tune by Kopczyk's band (Artiphon, 1928).
Telefunken wrote:Do you or anyone else have any more examples of "SA marschiert" labels I could see? As I said, Its one of my favorites, so I'm fairly positive I'd love to see all the different versions.
Here are examples of some of the recordings of the full song and of various arrangements of the song, from SCF collectors. Of course, even more recordings were made, this is not all.

SAmarschiert.jpg
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Alexander B.
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Post by Alexander B. » 07 Jun 2015 05:57

Ivan Ž. wrote:Here are examples of some of the recordings of the full song and of various arrangements of the song, from SCF collectors. Of course, even more recordings were made, this is not all.
What a great assortment of labels and versions. Thanks for sharing those for me. I've never heard the "Im Schlesierland" version, I'll add that to the list of songs like Sturm 23/7 version of "Deutscher Kampf im Lied" that I want to hear that nobody seems willing to share with me!

I'm drooling over those, I especially like that NS-Schallplatten-Industrie version.
Maybe you know someone who is selling a version of it somewhere, Ivan?

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Post by Ivan Ž. » 07 Jun 2015 10:42

Telefunken wrote:I'm drooling over those, I especially like that NS-Schallplatten-Industrie version.
Maybe you know someone who is selling a version of it somewhere, Ivan?
No, no, no, don't drool, it is absolutely horrible! I tried but I NEVER managed to listen to any recording by the Schalmeienkapelle "Horst Wessel" completely. I think 20 seconds of this demoralizing and depressing off-key noise is the maximum my ears can take. Maybe even less. I don't know anyone who sells it and I wouldn't recommend it to you, to anyone, not even to my worst enemy.
Telefunken wrote:I've never heard the "Im Schlesierland" version, I'll add that to the list of songs like Sturm 23/7 version of "Deutscher Kampf im Lied" that I want to hear that nobody seems willing to share with me!
As I already told you privately, cool it down with the political material. Nazism and similar ideologies are still very much alive and I do not want this forum and especially myself to participate in any type of spreading of any political propaganda.

Cheers,
Ivan

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Alexander B.
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Post by Alexander B. » 07 Jun 2015 13:53

Info is appreciated, Ivan. Thank you.

I was not commenting on the quality of the band, but the label (although I've never heard that particular group, so I'd have nothing to compare it to) The N-S-I records have beautiful font choices specifically, I especially like the few that I've seen with a Fraktur font. I also like how everything is arranged in a circular way around the center of the label with artwork (if a Swastika can really be called that) in the center by itself. I have noticed that many of the N-S-I records are of a lower quality, they're very thin records, and I imagine that they would have worn very fast on the record players of the time. Just something different compared to the standard labels I see, I like the Telefunken "Weinacht" records for the same reason, with a little picture up-top.

Regarding the neo-nazi menace and their hindering of my ability to collect records or collect information:

I don't quite understand the aversion everyone has to political records, I understand that there are risks in collecting them in Europe, and risks in sharing the content, but is this not an apolitical forum with a musical discussion area that is here specifically for that purpose? It is just music, it is only dangerous to those who decide to make it so. That is, of course, nothing personal against you, Ivan, I am just becoming frustrated because I don't understand why there is so much worry (everywhere, on every forum I've been to) put into making sure historically viable information is hidden. I understand now why it took me so long to find people willing to introduce me to this hobby. Every collector I've talked to has looked at me funny and scurried off.
I suppose the neo-nazi's have to ruin historical exploration for everyone, but I am only curious, I understand that letting them have material like that would be a bad day for everyone, but isn't there a point where we just have to stop letting them ruin things for us? I would appreciate a source via PM if that is at all possible, and that way it won't be online for them to find themselves, and I would not distribute it. I apologize for the failure to consider that idiots like that still roam around, as said before, we are lucky not to have to listen to them much here in the United States, but we have our own breed or racists, and they ruin just as many things for us.
Last edited by Alexander B. on 07 Jun 2015 14:28, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Schmeisser » 07 Jun 2015 14:27

Ivan Ž. wrote:
Telefunken wrote:I'm drooling over those, I especially like that NS-Schallplatten-Industrie version.
Maybe you know someone who is selling a version of it somewhere, Ivan?
No, no, no, don't drool, it is absolutely horrible! I tried but I NEVER managed to listen to any recording by the Schalmeienkapelle "Horst Wessel" completely. I think 20 seconds of this demoralizing and depressing off-key noise is the maximum my ears can take. Maybe even less. I don't know anyone who sells it and I wouldn't recommend it to you, to anyone, not even to my worst enemy.
Ahaha! :D The same thing!

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Post by Ivan Ž. » 07 Jun 2015 15:53

Telefunken wrote: is this not an apolitical forum with a musical discussion area that is here specifically for that purpose?
Yes, it is indeed an apolitical forum - but who says the members and visitors are? It is all public, available to everyone, sane and insane. And while three persons might use the political material for an apolitical research, next 300 will use it for political propaganda. We already discussed this privately and I really don't have much time to repeat myself over and over, please understand that.
Telefunken wrote:It is just music
It is NOT just music. It has lyrics, it has a message - a brainwashing, seemingly constructive but in fact very much destructive message, which sticks to one's brain, wrapped in a nice, catchy melody, designed to be repeated in one's mind until the message is carried out. Remember the Sirens & Ulysses' crew? There are still nazis around, communists, Germans, Jews, Americans, Brits, everything is the same as in 1933, only the places/roles have been switched here and there, but nothing was extincted since then. And if we know what happened after people in Germany sang "Deutschland erwache - Juda den Tod", I don't think it would be a sane behavior to enable people (and not only in Germany - but in the entire world, which internet covers) to sing the same brainwashing paroles today again, in one big online karaoke party.

In theory, if it's all just music - then why are we discussing "SA marschiert" instead of the original, "Argonnerlied"? Most of workers' songs (NS/communist) were only covers of existing songs; workers obviously didn't have much imagination nor many composers among them during the "Struggle period". So if one is interested in the music itself, politics is surely not the place to search for it.
Telefunken wrote:it is only dangerous to those who decide to make it so
So is a knife - does that mean that we should put knives in everyone's hands and see what happens?
Telefunken wrote:I suppose the neo-nazi's have to ruin historical exploration for everyone, but I am only curious, I understand that letting them have material like that would be a bad day for everyone, but isn't there a point where we just have to stop letting them ruin things for us? I would appreciate a source via PM if that is at all possible, and that way it won't be online for them to find themselves, and I would not distribute it.
Please understand that all neonazis already wrote that same text to me and to other collectors (not accusing you of anything of course, but only letting you know such requests are being sent all the time). It is always the same: "I am not a nazi. Can you send me this song for my personal use". YouTube is now filled with public pro-nazi channels with such recordings for personal use. So - no more.

Cheers,
Ivan

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Alexander B.
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Re:

Post by Alexander B. » 08 Jun 2015 11:37

Oh my, I realize that you are very passionate about this topic, I apologize for upsetting you.
I did not believe that neo-nazi's were that big of an issue with this hobby, and even if it was I didn't know they caused that much of a problem as far as distribution of musical materials go. a 100:1 ratio as far as interest goes is not good news.

As far as music, I was using it as a general word, not in reference to just the melody. I think all different versions are interesting, that is why you have seen me ask a-lot about different versions of things I've already heard or things I already have, I enjoy the variety and differences between known materials, the different groups of lyricists and bands I also admit that I am very interested in the political music as a whole, even though I collect a broad assortment of different kinds of marches and musics. It is a largely unexplored and misunderstood cog of the nazi era propaganda machine, and a part of the history that has not lost all of its mystery elements, most other parts being turned over so many different times that everything possible is known about them. All I was trying to state is that having moments like hearing "Ein Volk- Ein Reich" or the version of "Wir sind Kameraden" I found for the first time are enjoyable, like reading a new book or discovering a new food. The topic of discussion is just different, and despite the nature of the subject I still find the experience rather enjoyable and just would like to have more of them. I do not think it is advisable to distribute everything publicly, and I respect your opinion on sharing with random people that make accounts just to ask, and it is of course, your choice if you'd like to share with me. But I do find it a little disheartening that I am beyond a shadow of a doubt as far as a culprit for both neo-nazi political feelings, or the distribution of controversial recordings to people of dubious intention. I've never shared materials given to me in confidence or even shared newly discovered materials with anyone but members of the forum that I trust, nor have I ever expressed a neo-nazi view on anything, because I don't have that view. I realize that insulting me is definitely not the intent, but I've been collecting for a few years now, and have put a-lot of effort into the hobby for the sake of the information, and have shown interest in much more than just political records. I realize a neo-nazi could harbor views in secret while collecting, but I don't feel that someone like that would really put so much effort or money into exploring the subject, and instead would ask for all the materials instead of purchasing a copy for themselves even when copies and information are available outside the forum. They also focus purely on one or a few versions of the same few songs over and over again, thats why things like "Sieg heil, Victoria" end up as gathering points for them. I've noticed that they usually are more concerned with stealing the music for profit or using it to further their goals as fast as possible for as cheap as possible. I really am interested in collecting the physical records and their information, and hope that intent comes across in my interest. once again, that is nothing personal against you, Ivan, I understand why things are done a certain way, I just don't agree with the idea that information is so tightly controlled that it is restricted to a singular person or singular group of collectors within the community, and once again, I understand that the restricting of information for those that are genuinely interested is not the intent of the great importance of keeping riffraff away, however that is the end result of the amount of caution put in place.

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Post by Ivan Ž. » 08 Jun 2015 15:20

Telefunken wrote:As far as music, I was using it as a general word, not in reference to just the melody
Now think: if sad music makes broken people cry even more, depressing music makes depressed people more depressed, party music makes jolly people want to party - what do you think that propaganda/war music does to hot-shots? There is no "just music". Music influences human emotions and behavior, some more some less, but always does; and it can be way more lethal than an actual weapon.
Telefunken wrote:I just don't agree with the idea that information is so tightly controlled that it is restricted to a singular person or singular group of collectors within the community
I don't understand where did you get this idea, but there is no community, nor a group (as in a connected group) of collectors. There was a forum (SCF), but it doesn't exist anymore, and nevertheless even then it was the info that was being exchanged, not the sound files. The information isn't and wasn't tightly controlled, it was largely lost already during WWII; but now, as you may have seen, it is becoming more and more available to public, thanks to enthusiasts like myself who spend years (soon decades) of daily research and are recovering it from oblivion, from collector to collector, from document to document, one by one. All for free (but apparently this isn't enough). There is no some secret database or storage of material, if that's what you thought. At least that I know of.

Note: several posts dealing with the "Argonnerlied" have been split off into a new topic.

Cheers,
Ivan

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Re:

Post by Teppeny » 27 Aug 2018 14:48

Hello, Is there any recording on the internet of "Im Schlesierland marschieren wir" ?

Best regards,
Teppeny

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