This document records a meeting in Budapest between two Hungarian Zionist leaders, Rezsoe Kasztner and Samuel Springmann, with a visiting Austrian industrialist, identified only as "Herr X". From the details given about "Herr X", Aly and Gerlach conclude that he is none other than the well-known Oskar Schindler.
Schindler had some interesting things to say. Here are some of them; they consist of a question by Kasztner and Springmann, followed by Schindler's answer:
In expressing the above opinion, Schindler effectively negated one of the three central theses of the "Holocaust" concept, namely that there was a centrally ordered and organised German Government program to exterminate specifically all Jews in German hands.- Wieviel Juden existieren noch in Polen? Er denkt nach und rechnet.
- Es gibt noch etwa 17 Lager. In diesen koennen 220 - 250.000 Juden leben. Diese sind legal. Ausser diesen leben beinahe ebenso viele illegal versteckt in Bunkern, bei Ariern, auf arischen Papieren, als Halbjuden oder als Partisanen.
- Wollen Sie uns erklaeren, gab es eine allgemeine Verordnung zur Ausrottung der Juden von Polen? Wenn ja, warum ist noch 1/4 Million am Leben gelassen? Wenn nicht: warum haben sie Millionen vernichtet?
- Ich glaube nicht, lautet die Antwort, dass es eine allgemeine Verordnung gab. Ich nehme eher an, dass ein jeder SS-Fuehrer den anderen mit Vernichtungsziffern uebertreffen wollte. Keiner von diesen wollte seine Karriere aufs Spiel setzen. Die Initiative ist aber nicht von ihnen gekommen. Eine hoehere Stelle hat sie beauftragt, wahrscheinlich gefaehrliche oder nutzlose Juden zu vernichten. Sie haben diesen Auftrag mit der Brutalitaet vollstreckt, an die sie schon zu Hause gewoehnt waren. [......]
- How many Jews still exist in Poland? He thinks about it and calculates.
- There are still about 17 camps. In these 220-250,000 Jews may be living. These are the legal ones. Apart from them, almost as many are living illegally in hiding, in Bunkers, with Aryans, on Aryan papers, as half-Jews or as partisans.
- Will you explain to us, was there a general order for the extermination of the Jews of Poland? If yes, why have 1/4 million been left alive? If not, why have they destroyed millions?
- I do not believe, goes the answer, that there was a general order. Rather, I presume that each individual SS-leader wanted to outdo the others with numbers of those destroyed. None of them wanted to put his career on the line. But the initiative did not come from them. A higher authority has commissioned them, probably to destroy dangerous or useless Jews. They have executed this commission with the brutality to which they were already used to at home. [.....]
Instead of a general order to exterminate all Jews (which would derive from an irrational anti-Semitism), Schindler believed that SS-leaders had been commissioned by a higher authority, presumably Himmler, to kill two specific categories of Jews, namely those considered dangerous and those considered useless. In other words, the authorisation to kill was selective, and based on rational criteria.
The two different types of killing, of dangerous opponents on the one hand and "useless eaters" on the other, were applied by the German Government not only to Jews but to many different population groups under its control. Examples of dangerous opponents, the killing of whom was authorised, are leading Bolsheviks, commissars, potential resistance leaders etc. Examples of "useless eaters" are non-working mental patients in Germany and in some occupied countries.
According to Schindler, the authorisation to kill was implemented by individual SS-leaders with the brutality that was part of the corporate culture of that organisation, and competed with each other to achieve the highest "score", thus resulting in such a high death-toll.
It is apparent that Schindler's analysis of the driving force behind the mass-killing is totally compatible with the thesis proposed by David Irving in 1977, according to which there was no centralised extermination program ordered by Hitler, but rather a series of separate actions by individual German authorities.