ID from a German General with Mussolini in a parade
- asturwaffen
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- Location: España
ID from a German General with Mussolini in a parade
I am interested in acquiring this photo. Please somebody identifies the general German. The photo was taken while they reviewed to a unit motorized Italian before going to fight against the Soviets.
Greetings and thanks in advance.
Greetings and thanks in advance.
- Stauffenberg II
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- Dieter Zinke
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- Location: Koblenz / germany
Hi Stauffenberg II,
because I' m not sure about Rintelen here a colour pic
(source: former german journal "Kristall" in the sixties last century):
In summer 1942 Mussolini (marked with arrow) visits Tobruk. Far right is Oberst Hans Hecker (Pionierführer der Panzerarmee Afrika), the general at is left side ist General Enno von Rintelen. Look at the ribbon bar (italian decorations), look at Spange zum EK I, look at KVK II with swords.
Cheers
Oberstab
because I' m not sure about Rintelen here a colour pic
(source: former german journal "Kristall" in the sixties last century):
In summer 1942 Mussolini (marked with arrow) visits Tobruk. Far right is Oberst Hans Hecker (Pionierführer der Panzerarmee Afrika), the general at is left side ist General Enno von Rintelen. Look at the ribbon bar (italian decorations), look at Spange zum EK I, look at KVK II with swords.
Cheers
Oberstab
- Attachments
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- Tobruk 2.jpg (226.97 KiB) Viewed 1664 times
Hello all,
I know I am off topic -- but the fabulous pic Oberstab shows Hans Hecker! I had posted these pics earlier on. There is definitely the resemblance between the Hecker in Oberstab's pic and the general in the Sdkfz 250/251. Both B/W pics were from a 4th Pz book, misidentified as Betzel.
If so, we have three known pics of Hecker!
cheers
Freiherr
I know I am off topic -- but the fabulous pic Oberstab shows Hans Hecker! I had posted these pics earlier on. There is definitely the resemblance between the Hecker in Oberstab's pic and the general in the Sdkfz 250/251. Both B/W pics were from a 4th Pz book, misidentified as Betzel.
If so, we have three known pics of Hecker!
cheers
Freiherr
- Attachments
-
- hecker1.jpg (29.85 KiB) Viewed 1638 times
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- hecker2.jpg (40.83 KiB) Viewed 1638 times
- Dieter Zinke
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- Joined: 02 Dec 2003, 10:12
- Location: Koblenz / germany
Hi Oberstab,
That's the frustrating part. Definitely not Betzel either. There are very many Betzel pics, almost by every two months during 44 - 45, ( e.g. Diesener, Loibl, von Gaudecker Zuch, Schaefer, etc ) in award ceremonies of other members of 4 Pz Div, as well as of himself! No way in my opinion did any of known Betzel pics resemble the general in the SPW. For fear of venturing even further off topic, how about the RKT in the pic? Could give a clue or two.
Sent you a PM. Need your help.
Cheers
Freiherr
That's the frustrating part. Definitely not Betzel either. There are very many Betzel pics, almost by every two months during 44 - 45, ( e.g. Diesener, Loibl, von Gaudecker Zuch, Schaefer, etc ) in award ceremonies of other members of 4 Pz Div, as well as of himself! No way in my opinion did any of known Betzel pics resemble the general in the SPW. For fear of venturing even further off topic, how about the RKT in the pic? Could give a clue or two.
Sent you a PM. Need your help.
Cheers
Freiherr
- Dieter Zinke
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- Joined: 02 Dec 2003, 10:12
- Location: Koblenz / germany
Dear Freiherr,freiherr wrote:Hi Oberstab,
That's the frustrating part. Definitely not Betzel either. There are very many Betzel pics, almost by every two months during 44 - 45, ( e.g. Diesener, Loibl, von Gaudecker Zuch, Schaefer, etc ) in award ceremonies of other members of 4 Pz Div, as well as of himself! No way in my opinion did any of known Betzel pics resemble the general in the SPW. For fear of venturing even further off topic, how about the RKT in the pic? Could give a clue or two.
Sent you a PM. Need your help.
Cheers
Freiherr
last attempt: it could be the commanders of the appropriate Korps of the 4. PD !? So, the pic 2 could show Martin Gareis, KG XXXXVI. PzK, and pic 1 seems to be Walter Melzer, KG XXIII. AK. Please check the possibilities.
Best wishes,
your Oberstab
Hi Oberstab,
I like the Meltzer theory, thanks. As to Gareis, there is resemblance but in my humble opinion, the unidentified general looked a little too heavy set for Gareis. A Luftwaffe field division general? But the original definitely did not show a luftwaffe cap.
Where are Hans and Stauffenberg II and VJK and JC and Glenn, our usual expert panel?
Cheers
Freiherr
I like the Meltzer theory, thanks. As to Gareis, there is resemblance but in my humble opinion, the unidentified general looked a little too heavy set for Gareis. A Luftwaffe field division general? But the original definitely did not show a luftwaffe cap.
Where are Hans and Stauffenberg II and VJK and JC and Glenn, our usual expert panel?
Cheers
Freiherr
- J.N. Houterman
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Hi!
I have to agree with Hans here, but..... here is my limited input.
1. Re the Rintelen pic (we seem to have got a little off the original topic, but it's still very interesting): I tend to agree with Stauffenberg II - the face fits and the place fits, though the lack of the Spange zum EK I and KVK II with swords does give me cause for concern.
2. Re Pics 1 & 2: Because of the lack of definition in both pics it is very difficult to be sure of a precise ID, but IMHO I don't think they are Gareis or Melzer. From Pic Nr. 2, it is not even clear that the officer is a General, though obviously a commander of some sorts.
Sorry to have just a negative input, but it's the best I can do under the circumstances.
Regards,
VJK
I have to agree with Hans here, but..... here is my limited input.
1. Re the Rintelen pic (we seem to have got a little off the original topic, but it's still very interesting): I tend to agree with Stauffenberg II - the face fits and the place fits, though the lack of the Spange zum EK I and KVK II with swords does give me cause for concern.
2. Re Pics 1 & 2: Because of the lack of definition in both pics it is very difficult to be sure of a precise ID, but IMHO I don't think they are Gareis or Melzer. From Pic Nr. 2, it is not even clear that the officer is a General, though obviously a commander of some sorts.
Sorry to have just a negative input, but it's the best I can do under the circumstances.
Regards,
VJK
- Richard Murphy
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- Location: Bletchley, England
Hmmm! Is that not a Divisional emblem on the car (I think it's a Horch.), my limited (paper) resources don't stretch that far, but the crossed Swords beneath may indicate a divisional CO as a Schwerter winner al lá "Sepp" Dietrich?freiherr wrote:Hello all,
I know I am off topic -- but the fabulous pic Oberstab shows Hans Hecker! I had posted these pics earlier on. There is definitely the resemblance between the Hecker in Oberstab's pic and the general in the Sdkfz 250/251. Both B/W pics were from a 4th Pz book, misidentified as Betzel.
If so, we have three known pics of Hecker!
cheers
Freiherr
Regards from the Park,
Rich
Looking at trees (with leaves) the photos must have been taken sometime between late spring and early fall. Also the house on the first picture looks more like central European (or not?).
During this period the division was subordinated to next commanding generals:
Hossbach (56.Pz.Korps),
Harteneck (1.Kav.Korps),
Vormann (Gruppe Vormann),
Felzamnn (Korpsgruppe Felzmann),
v.Saucken (39.Pz.Korps).
Cheers
During this period the division was subordinated to next commanding generals:
Hossbach (56.Pz.Korps),
Harteneck (1.Kav.Korps),
Vormann (Gruppe Vormann),
Felzamnn (Korpsgruppe Felzmann),
v.Saucken (39.Pz.Korps).
Cheers