Ostasiatisches ExpeditionKorps

Discussions on all aspects of the German Colonies and Overseas Expeditions. Hosted by Chris Dale.
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Seesoldat
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Post by Seesoldat » 05 Jan 2007 13:32

To my mind a couple of questions are still unanswered and I will try my best:

To the "East Asian Marine Detachment" (OMD) belonged three companies: Two of them in Tientsin and one in Peking. Further on they had an artillery detachment with howizers.

On July 27th 1914 did they achieve the order to go to Tsingtau, which they reached on August 2nd after many difficulties. In the original garrisons stayed for guard duty at the German embassy in Peking and the German consulate at Tientsin only small forces. These garrisons stood in co-existence with the enemy garrisons. The total of the OMD when reaching Tsingtao was in accordance to their war diary 411 soldiers of alle ranks.

Interesting is, that the OMD was responsible for the left flank of the delay operation during the defence of Tsingtao and led the only mayor German counterattack on the advancing Japanese forces on October 2nd 1914.

The pre-war history of the OMD is as follows:

In Fall 1901 the "East Asian Expeditionary Force" was transformed to the "East Asian Occupational Force" combined with a huge reduction of strength. The occupation force was reduced within 1902 to a total of 34 and from 1903 on to app. 15 companies. They were garrisoned in different cities - Peking, Tientsin, Schanhaikwan, Yangtsun, Tsingtao, ...

In 1902 the three brigades became three regiments of infantry, the artillery regiment became an artillery batallion and the cavalry regiment became a company.
In 1903 the third regiment was disbanded and all support units (artillery, engineers etc.) were reduced to companies/batteries.

In 1906 the "East Asian Occupational Force" was transformed to the "East Asian Detachment" with four infantry companies and one artillery battery. Only Peking and Tientsin did survive as garrisons.

In 1909 the "East Asian Detachment" was again transformed and became "East Asian Marine Detachment" - as part of the 3rd Seebataillon in Tientsin. It also was reduced to one company of infantry and had to wear the uniforms of the imperial Marines.

When in 1912 the revolution took place in China it was strengthened up to the above mentioned level. From that point on it was an independent unit again - but still wearing the uniforms of the 3rd Seebataillon.

As far as the OOB of the German forces in China concerns, Peter forgot the "Marine Expeditionary Force", which arrived on the theatre before the "East Asian Expeditionary Force" on August 15th near Taku:

- 1st Seebataillon from Kiel
- 2nd Seebataillon from Wilhelmshaven
- a mobile Marine field battery
- a Marine engineer detachment
- medical service

Sincerely Yours

Markus

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Peter H
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Post by Peter H » 05 Jan 2007 13:38

Thanks Markus for sharing your knowledge on this subject.

Regards
Peter

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Chris Dale
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Post by Chris Dale » 08 Mar 2007 03:35

There's a new German website on the Boxer Rebellion at http://www.boxeraufstand.com it's got a full Rangliste for the East Asian Expeditionary Korps... the site is still in the process of being built but so far it's very interesting.

Cheers
Chris

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Peter H
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Post by Peter H » 11 Sep 2007 11:38


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Oskar_2ndChev
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Post by Oskar_2ndChev » 12 Sep 2007 21:06

Excellent information Markus!

Markus, maybe you could shed some light on a couple of questions regarding Seebatallion orgainzation and weapons:

1) Do you know what the organization is below the company level (i.e., how many platoons make up the company, how many men in a platoon, etc.)?

2) Were machineguns assigned to the Seeballion and if so, what model?

3) For the field artillery, what model gun was employed?

Thanks in advance for any information!

Adam

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Seitengewehr98
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Post by Seitengewehr98 » 30 Oct 2007 08:40

Wonderful thread, already answered a few question of mine. I'm new at this, so please forgive me if this is a silly question. I notice that the batallions of the Infantry Regiments were attributed to different German states (Prussian, Saxon, Wurttemburg, etc.). I also know that Reich colors were worn by NCO's and officers of the East Asian forces. Now, if Reich colors were being worn, then there would be no affiliation with particular states. I figured out a way that could make the wear of both state colors and reich colors make sense. When the East Asian Expeditionary Corps was formed, the individual voluntary batallions fell under the state they came from, and thus state colors were worn. When it was reformed in to the East Asian Occupation Brigade, it was reorganized under the Reich, and therefore, reich colors were worn. Am I way off here, or is this correct?

Thanks, and again, my apologies for my ignorance.
Nate

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Chris Dale
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Post by Chris Dale » 03 Nov 2007 19:45

Yeah, that does seem to be about right. The Expeditionary Corps wore state insignia (cockades, pickelhaube plates etc) but the later Occupation Brigade didn't.

I'm still a slightly confused however with the Expeditionary Corps cavalry, artillery etc which were not organised into state units (as far as I know) but were made up of volunteers from the different states armies. Did these men wear their own states cockades on an individual basis? And more curiously the cavalry all wore pickelhaubes, so what happened if a Saxon hussar (for example) joined up? Was he issued a Saxon Pickelhaube just for the duration?

Cheers
Chris

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Seitengewehr98
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Post by Seitengewehr98 » 04 Nov 2007 09:57

Excellent question!! Thanks for answering mine as well. Is there such a thing as a Reichs Pickelhaube? There is a model listed in Jurgen Kraus's "The German Army in the First World War: Uniforms and Equipment", on page 18 and 19, which shows examples of the M.1900 Helmet for Troops of the East Asia Occupation Brigade. It states "It is decorated with an aluminium bronze Imperial Eagle and, since it was worn by troops of the German empire, has the imperial cockade on the right side, but no regional cockade on the left." Any photos of the mounted or arty East Asian units out there? Perhaps we could at least get a look at the front plate. Chris, I hope that maybe this helps?

Nate

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Chris Dale
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Post by Chris Dale » 06 Nov 2007 14:37

Yes the Reichspickelhaube was introduced for the Occupation Brigade. But prior to that state pickelhaubes were worn. Here's some photos-

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=115435

These photos all seem to show Prussian plates with a Guard star.

Cheers
Chris

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Peter H
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Post by Peter H » 22 Nov 2007 13:52

Ostasiatisches Infanterie-Regiment Standarte:

Image



Ostasiatisches Reiter-Regiment Standarte:

Image


From: http://wiki-de.genealogy.net/wiki/Milit ... Regimenter

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Chris Dale
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Post by Chris Dale » 02 Jan 2008 02:26

Chris Dale wrote:
I'm still a slightly confused however with the Expeditionary Corps cavalry, artillery etc which were not organised into state units (as far as I know) but were made up of volunteers from the different states armies. Did these men wear their own states cockades on an individual basis? And more curiously the cavalry all wore pickelhaubes, so what happened if a Saxon hussar (for example) joined up? Was he issued a Saxon Pickelhaube just for the duration?
I've found the answer to my own question. Johan Somers states in his excellent new book "Imperial German Uniforms and Equipment 1907-18 Vol3" (published by Schiffer) that the cavalry, artillery etc of the East Asian Expeditionary Corps all wore Prussian Guard stars on their Pickelhauben. This would certainly seem to match the photos we've seen of the cavalry so far.
Happy New Year to you all,
Cheers
Chris
PS Thanks Peter for the great pictures...

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Mike Blake
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Post by Mike Blake » 05 Feb 2008 13:09

Heres what I have, FWIW. Much comes from Chris D anyway, and I haven't gone throught the above postings to cross check with my ino yet - will do this when I start to finish the German chapter.

Date: 10-26 June 1900
Location: 1st [Seymour] International Relief Expedition
Units: Capt von Usedom, 427 sailors, ships companies SMS Gefion, Hansa, Hertha, Iltis and Kaiserin Augusta. [Harrington 2001]:

Commander: Kapitän z S v Usedom
Adjutant: Oberleutnant z S Freiherr v Kottwitz.
Infanterie:
1 (Hertha) Kompagnie: Führer Kap-Lt Hecht, Ob-Lt z S Bunnemann, Ob-Lt z S Schnabel, Lt z S Berendes.
2 (Hansa) Kompagnie: Führer Kap-Lt Schlieper, Ob-Lt z S v Zerßen, Ob-Lt z S Röhr, Lt z S Schultz (Max), Lt z S Becker.
3. (Kaiserin Augusta) Kompagnie: Korv-Kapt Buchholtz, Ob-Lt z S v Bülow (Hermann), Lt z S Schütte, Stückmeister Wehde
4. (Gefion) Kompagnie: Führer Kapt-Lt Weniger, Ob-Lt z S Krohn, Ob-Lt z S Lustig
Artillery:
2 Machineguns: Lt z S Pfeiffer
Pioneers: Lt z S Blockhuis
Medical Detachement:
Stabsarzt Dr Schlick
Oberassistenzarzt Dr Presuhn
16 litter bearers and medical orderlies
Total: 20 officers, 489 NCOS and men. [Boxeraufstand]

Date: 17 June 1900
Location: Taking Of The Taku Forts
Units: [MRB details need adding]

Date: 17 June-13 July 1900
Location: Siege of Peking Legations
Units: Oberleutnant Count von Soden, Lt von Strauch, Imperial Guard [Retired], 5 NCOs and 45 men from the III Sëebataillon from Kiatschou.
Casualties: 12 killed and 14 wounded. [Peyrot. Weber]

Date: 25th June 1900
Location: China
Units: Germany ‘China Marine Expeditionary Force’ (Erstes Expeditionskorps fuer China). 2,528 men, consisting I and II Sëebataillons and supporting elements with the addition of 1100 volunteers from the army:
GOC General von Hoepfner
Chief of Staff Regimental Adjutant von Glassenap
1st Seebataillon, 4 companies (Maj von Madai)
2nd Seebataillon, 4 companies (Maj von Kronhelm)
Mounted Field Artillery Battery, 6 x 8.8 cm guns (Capt Bloch von Blottnitz)
Engineer/Pioneer Detachment (Capt Klehmet)
Signals Detachment (Telegraphists) (Oberlt Gundel)
Field Hospital Detachment (Chief Marine Surgeons Dr Huth and Dr Schlick
Field Bakery
[Peyrot. Weber. Lettow4beck]

Date: 18th August 1900
Location: China
Units: reinforcements of sailors under Naval Capt Bohl. [Weber] [MRB details need adding eg what ships did they come from, how many, officers etc]

Date: 23rd August 1900
Location: China
Units: Remainder of I Sëebataillon. [Weber]

Date: 3rd July 1900.
Location: Germany. China from September 1900.
Units: ‘German East Asian Expeditionary Corps’. Initially 11,500 men, formed in Germany from volunteers from the whole German army. 12th August 1900. Reinforcements of 7,700 all ranks were added. General Field Marshal von Waldersee was appointed C-I-C of all Allied troops in China.
Corps Staff: GOC Lt Gen von Lessel; Lt Col Gündell chief of staff; regimental adjutant with 4 officers; some aides de camp; Topographic service; Chief Medical Officer [General Krosta]; Protestant and Catholic chaplains.
1st Infantry Brigade (Gen von Trotha & Staff)
1st Infantry Regiment (Col von Normann): 2 battalions of 4 companies and 1 extra company
2nd Infantry Regiment (Lt Col Pavel): 2 battalions of 4 companies and 1 extra company
Combined Regiment of Marines (I and II Seebataillon)
2nd Infantry Brigade Brigade (Gen von Kettler & Staff)
3rd Infantry Regiment (Col Freiherr von Ledebur): 2 battalions of 4 companies and 1 extra company
4th Infantry Regiment (Col Hoffmeister): 2 battalions of 4 companies and 1 extra company
3rd Infantry Brigade [CO u/k & Staff]
5th Infantry Regiment (Col von Rohrscheidt): 2 battalions of 4 companies and possibly 1 extra company
6th Infantry Regiment (Col Grüber): 2 battalions of 4 companies and 1 extra company.*
Jäger company (Capt Schmid)
1 Cavalry regiment: 4 squadrons, 800 men (Lt Col von Arnstedt)
1 Field Artillery regiment: 9 batteries [in 3 detachments, Abteilungen]; 4 Field Gun, 2 Light Howitzers, 2 Mountain, 1 Marine Artillery, each battery 6 guns and 3 munition carts. [Weber]
1 Heavy Howitzer Field Battalion: 2 Batteries of 6 guns each, 176 all ranks.
1 Pioneer battalion: 4 coys Pontooneers.
1 Telegraphist section
1 Railway Construction battalion: staff & 3 coys
1 Bearer Company
Ammunition Columns; 2 Infantry, 2 Artillery , 1 Field Howitzer & 2 Heavy Howitzer
Train: 3 Provision Columns, 1 Field Bakery, 6 Field Hospitals.
[Weber] [MRB have details of where units came from ie parent regiments – is this worth including?]

*There is doubt about the actual existence of the extra (or 9th) companies in the 3rd Brigade. Sources are not clear, no company commanders names are given [Weber]. According to one source the 9th Infantry companies were to be used as depot and lines of communication troops. [Misc]
Date: 1901
Location: China. ‘East Asian Occupation Brigade’
Units: 3,600 men, Maj Gen Rohrscheidt
3 infantry regiments
1 cavalry squadron
1 artillery detachment
1 pioneer company
1 train company
Supporting staff & medics
[Dale]

Date: 1906
Location: China. East Asian Detachment [Ostasiatischen Detachement]
Units: 1,100 men
[Dale]


Are any of the posters of photos here prepared to let them be used in a book on the Uprising? If so could they pleae get in touch with me. Thanks.

Christianmery
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Re: Ostasiatischen ExpeditionKorps

Post by Christianmery » 13 Aug 2009 06:03

Hello,

I am french and I writte article on the bayonet PMF 1871/98. I search informations and picture with soldiers and baïonnettes during the campagne Boxer of Chine. Can you help me ?
Image
amitiés de France.
christianmery@wanadoo.fr

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Mike Blake
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Re: Ostasiatischen ExpeditionKorps

Post by Mike Blake » 13 Aug 2009 08:15

Christianmery

Welcome - I do have a lot of material on the Germans in the BU including some photos (other than those posted here - I assume you have looked back through them for what you want?). I would be happy to send it all to you for you to see if it has anything of any use to you.

In return, would you be prepared to share what you have already, please? I too am a writer in the UK, finishing a book on the BU. Any help would be acknowledged of course. I am particulary looking for publishable photos of weapons and equipment.

If you haven't already, you must look at Chris Dale's website on the Germans - it is a cornucopia of information http://www.germancolonialuniforms.co.uk

Regards

Mike

Christianmery
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Re: Ostasiatischen ExpeditionKorps

Post by Christianmery » 13 Aug 2009 08:38

Forgive me my English very bad but I have many photos of German soldiers with bayonets. I am a collector of German bayonets and I have a large number of models.
If I can help it with pleasure.
amitiés de France.

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