German Muslims in Wehrmacht?

Discussions on the foreigners (volunteers as well as conscripts) fighting in the German Wehrmacht, those collaborating with the Axis and other period Far Right organizations. Hosted by George Lepre.
Helmut Von Moltke
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German Muslims in Wehrmacht?

Post by Helmut Von Moltke » 02 Nov 2005 05:35

Did any Muslims who were German serve in the Wehrmacht?

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Mehmet Fatih
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Re: German Muslims in Wehrmacht?

Post by Mehmet Fatih » 02 Nov 2005 23:22

Helmut Von Moltke wrote:Did any Muslims who were German serve in the Wehrmacht?


http://www.turkhaber.org/30.html

This link is about Turkestan Legion.According to this link, the legion was commanded between October 1944- December 1944 by an SS-Standartenführer called Harun Rashid.The officer is said to be a Turk who went Germany during WW1 and settled there after the war.It seems a bit unrealistic cause they wouldnt accept a Turk in SS.At least he wouldnt achieve a rank this high.So this Harun Rashid is probably a muslim German with a muslim name.
I have no idea about muslim Germans in Wehrmacht.But i am sure there were Germans in Wehrmacht with muslim beliefs.Although it is a work of fiction, i remember a muslim comrade of Sven Hassel in his books.

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Daniel Laurent
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Re: German Muslims in Wehrmacht?

Post by Daniel Laurent » 04 Nov 2005 14:23

Helmut Von Moltke wrote:Did any Muslims who were German serve in the Wehrmacht?


Muslims served in the Wehrmacht as well as the Waffen SS but none of them was German.
Make a search here about Handsharr for details.
Beside them, few Arabs served in France, Arab Legion.

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Daniel

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Mehmet Fatih
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Re: German Muslims in Wehrmacht?

Post by Mehmet Fatih » 04 Nov 2005 14:48

Daniel Laurent wrote:Muslims served in the Wehrmacht as well as the Waffen SS but none of them was German.


How can you know that?
There can be Muslim Germans in Wehrmacht.Although Islam was not a major religion in Third Reich, there could be German minority who accepte Islam as their religion.

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Daniel Laurent
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Re: German Muslims in Wehrmacht?

Post by Daniel Laurent » 04 Nov 2005 15:07

waffen_für _alle wrote:How can you know that?
There can be Muslim Germans in Wehrmacht.Although Islam was not a major religion in Third Reich, there could be German minority who accepte Islam as their religion.Regards


German nationals being muslims in 1938 :lol:

Show me :?

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Daniel

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jarek_g
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German Muslims in Wehrmacht?

Post by jarek_g » 04 Nov 2005 21:54

Harun-el-Rashid Bey was really Wilhelm Hintersatz.

Wilhelm Hintersatz was born 26. 06. 1886 in Senftenberg. In 1 ww served as instructor in Turkish army . There also accepted Mussulman faith and receive new name Harun-el-Raschid Bey.
In II ww served in Heer as Major.
23.08.1944 pass to Waffen SS,
24.08.1944 was SS-Sturmbannführer.
1.09.1944 promoted to SS-Obersturmbannführer,
20.09.1944 Himmler charged him command new unit - Osttürkische Waffen-Verband der SS,
1.10.1944 promoted to SS-Standartenführer.
30. 12. 1944 discharged after mass - escape to partisans in Slovakia group soldiers of Waffengruppe „Krim" (commanded by Waffen-Obersturmführer Gulam Alimov) .
Further fates I don’t known.
Bestreg.
Jarek

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Mehmet Fatih
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Re: German Muslims in Wehrmacht?

Post by Mehmet Fatih » 04 Nov 2005 22:59

jarek_g wrote:Harun-el-Rashid Bey was really Wilhelm Hintersatz.

Wilhelm Hintersatz was born 26. 06. 1886 in Senftenberg. In 1 ww served as instructor in Turkish army . There also accepted Mussulman faith and receive new name Harun-el-Raschid Bey.
In II ww served in Heer as Major.
23.08.1944 pass to Waffen SS,
24.08.1944 was SS-Sturmbannführer.
1.09.1944 promoted to SS-Obersturmbannführer,
20.09.1944 Himmler charged him command new unit - Osttürkische Waffen-Verband der SS,
1.10.1944 promoted to SS-Standartenführer.
30. 12. 1944 discharged after mass - escape to partisans in Slovakia group soldiers of Waffengruppe „Krim" (commanded by Waffen-Obersturmführer Gulam Alimov) .
Further fates I don’t known.
Bestreg.
Jarek


jarej_g,

Thanks for this wonderful piece of information.
I just wonder, how on earth could you found this info about him.

Regards

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Daniel Laurent
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Re: German Muslims in Wehrmacht?

Post by Daniel Laurent » 05 Nov 2005 07:54

waffen_für _alle wrote:jarej_g,
Thanks for this wonderful piece of information.
I just wonder, how on earth could you found this info about him.
Regards

I also wonder... congratulation, Jaraj, you got me
:lol:
However, we have one German Muslim. We would need another one to justify the title of this thread: German Muslims in Wehrmacht
Or was he the exception to confirm the rule?
Regards
Daniel

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Mehmet Fatih
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Re: German Muslims in Wehrmacht?

Post by Mehmet Fatih » 05 Nov 2005 11:40

Daniel Laurent wrote:
waffen_für _alle wrote:jarej_g,
Thanks for this wonderful piece of information.
I just wonder, how on earth could you found this info about him.
Regards

I also wonder... congratulation, Jaraj, you got me
:lol:
However, we have one German Muslim. We would need another one to justify the title of this thread: German Muslims in Wehrmacht
Or was he the exception to confirm the rule?
Regards
Daniel


Oh Daniel, you are never satisfied. Eh? :)

Regards

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Daniel Laurent
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Re: German Muslims in Wehrmacht?

Post by Daniel Laurent » 05 Nov 2005 12:23

Oh Daniel, you are never satisfied. Eh? :)
Regards

Sorry, I am French :cry:
In France, bringing a polite and peacefull polemic between gentlemen up to the extreme end is considered as a very entertaining mental exercise.
And, as I am not getting younger, I like to give to my old brain some exercise before it shrinks too much.
So we have ONE German Muslim in the Wehrmacht
For the "s", we need two :lol:
By the way, like waffen_für _alle, I would really like to know *where* you got this information.
Regards
Daniel

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EdgarM
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Post by EdgarM » 29 Nov 2005 17:12

Anyone who has done research on muslim formations during WWII should have come across Harun-el-Rashid Beys name. It only took me a few minutes to find reference to him in Antonio Munoz' 'Forgotten Legions'.

A good friend of my father's was a Felgendarme with both Prinz Eugen and Handschar. I have countless stories from him of his service. He spoke of a driver in his Trupp, Sturmann Nadzic, who was born near Munich, emigrated to Yugoslavia as a child and converted to Islam upon the remarriage of his mother to a muslim after his father's death. I'm sure similar situations were probably quite common as so many Germans emigrated to the Balkans and eastern Europe before the second world war.

I'm in the process of transferring my notes on our friend's experiences to something approaching readable. As I do some further digging, this subject might be of interest as I have never really seen it covered.

Edgar

Ken S.
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Re: German Muslims in Wehrmacht?

Post by Ken S. » 09 May 2012 23:55

Any information on?:

Ibrahim Mohammed ruht auf der Kriegsgräberstätte in Ysselsteyn.
Endgrablage: Block CT Reihe 3 Grab 67
Nähere Informationen zu diesem Friedhof erhalten Sie hier.
Name und die persönlichen Daten des Obengenannten sind auch im Gedenkbuch der Kriegsgräberstätte verzeichnet. Sie können gern einen Auszug bei uns bestellen.
Bitte beachten Sie, dass auf einigen Friedhöfen nicht die aktuelle Version ausliegt, somit kann der Name Ihres Angehörigen darin evtl. noch nicht verzeichnet sein.
Nachname: Mohammed
Vorname: Ibrahim
Dienstgrad: Unteroffizier
Todes-/Vermisstendatum: 30.06.1943


Djuma Hussein ruht auf der Kriegsgräberstätte in Heilbronn-Wollhausstrasse.
Endgrablage: Block 10 Reihe 8 Grab 84
Nähere Informationen zu diesem Friedhof erhalten Sie hier.
Name und die persönlichen Daten des Obengenannten sind auch im Gedenkbuch der Kriegsgräberstätte verzeichnet. Sie können gern einen Auszug bei uns bestellen.
Bitte beachten Sie, dass auf einigen Friedhöfen nicht die aktuelle Version ausliegt, somit kann der Name Ihres Angehörigen darin evtl. noch nicht verzeichnet sein.
Nachname: Hussein
Vorname: Djuma
Dienstgrad: Soldat
Geburtsdatum: 1923
Geburtsort: Safad
Todes-/Vermisstendatum: 17.04.1944
Todes-/Vermisstenort: nicht verzeichnet


there are also a few more with the surname "Mohamed".

ninoo
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Re: German Muslims in Wehrmacht?

Post by ninoo » 12 May 2012 01:19

Two Abwehr agents:
Johannes Eppler, aka Husain Gaafar. He was a haj and taken part in Kondor Operation. Born from a German parent in Egypt, his mother later married with an Egyptian lawyer, who adopted him and raise him as a Muslim.
Ahmed Jabr, a German Palestinian. I don't know if he was Muslim except that his name sound a Muslim one. He was with Rahn during a German attempt to strengthed their's position during adventure in Iraq and Levant

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